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SBC churches that give to National conv. & CBF

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by shannonL, Jun 2, 2005.

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  1. shannonL

    shannonL New Member

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    Should SBC allow the churches that give to this apostate organization to remain in the convention? I realize this is a state to state sort of thing. When I pastored a SBC church in down east NC we had several churches that supported both. I feel as though if a church desires to support CBF that they cannot honestly suppport the Baptist Faith and Message. Any opinions?
     
    #1 shannonL, Jun 2, 2005
  2. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    The Baptist Faith & Message is not compulsary. Or at least it hasn't been. The Baptist General Convention of Texas, in fact, has affirmed the 1963 BF&M, not the 2000 version.

    I can see reasons why a church would support both organizations, though I think dual affiliation is a short-term situation; eventually, almost all will fall on one side of the fence or the other.
     
    #2 rsr, Jun 2, 2005
  3. shannonL

    shannonL New Member

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    I'am no longer involved in SBC circles since I was called to the mission field. We are raising our support as Ind. Bapt. However I will always have a soft spot for the Ole SBC. My parents attend a 5000 member SB church.
    The GC of T has confirmed the 1963 BF & M because the GC of T is moderate / liberal outfit.
    A church that can support the SBC of today and the CBF definitly has an identity crisis.
    I agree with you RSR "almost all will fall on one side of the fence or the other".
     
    #3 shannonL, Jun 2, 2005
  4. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    This condundrum is why many of us didn't show up at the next meeting of the Triennial Convention.
     
    #4 Squire Robertsson, Jun 2, 2005
  5. BruceB

    BruceB New Member

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    Shannon, What downeast church did you pastor? I live downeast myself, and attend Immanuel in Greenville. My church gives to both SBC and CBF, as some members have a preference for either/or. Please tell me more about our identity crisis. Bruce
     
    #5 BruceB, Jun 2, 2005
  6. Magnetic Poles

    Magnetic Poles New Member

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    Such divisive things as calling the CBF "apostate" is indicative of one reason for the abject failure of the forgotten "Bold Mission Thrust". Infighting diluted the goal of evangelizing the world by year 2000. Sad.
     
    #6 Magnetic Poles, Jun 2, 2005
  7. shannonL

    shannonL New Member

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    I pastored a little church called Quankie Bapt. Ch. in Roanoake Rapids NC.
    Just so you know I'm not a new comer to SBC. I grew up in a Bible preaching SBC church, saved in SBC church and called to ministry in SBC church. I attended Southeastern Baptist Seminary for quite some time after undrer grad at another Bible College.
    Typically, not always alot of churches that desire to give to CBF are moderate if not liberal in alot of their practices.
    -Believe in women pastors
    -do not believe in the inerrancy of Scripture.
    -often have neo orthodox view of Scripture.

    These are just a couple of things that I have experienced first hand from growing up in these circles as well as attending state convention meetings and associational meetings.

    CBF is very sympathetic to alot of liberal ideas.
    I know for a fact that they are sympathetic to Beeson Divinity School at Wake Forest which is where most of the liberal professors from Southeastern went once they were booted out by the trustees. They campus church at Wake Forest has in not now in times past gay deacons. CBF was sympathetic there.
    I know I just listed a few things but if you do research on the CBF, you will find without a doubt they are liberal to the core.
    Concerning "Bold Mission Thrust" I had a on going discussion with several pastors in our association down in NC. One of them with a woman pastor. I asked some of these cats point blank if they believed in the inerrancy of Scripture as well as infallibilty. 4 out of the 5 said they believed the Scriptures to be infallible when concerning salvivic matters but not historical.
    I personally don't want to "thrust foward" with those kind of folk in any mission endeavor.
    I know I will catch flak for this but the CBF is in direct opposition to the historical doctrinal beliefs of SBC.
    When God called me to the mission field I left Southern Baptist circles. I didn't want to wind up on the mission field with closet liberals. Which believe me there are some fine, God fearing missionaries who serve with IMB especially now. God just led me in another direction.
    Don't take my word for it concerning CBF go to their website. Research their positions. I promise you if you have deep Bible convictions your not going to want any money from your church going to that liberal outfit.
     
    #7 shannonL, Jun 2, 2005
  8. Ben W

    Ben W Active Member
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    Yet as more and more people that have the beliefs akin to the IFB, leave the SBC and join the IFB, the SBC will slide to the Moderate position by natural attrition.
     
    #8 Ben W, Jun 3, 2005
  9. Loren B

    Loren B New Member

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    A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. Get out ASAP!!!
     
    #9 Loren B, Jun 3, 2005
  10. shannonL

    shannonL New Member

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    For years in N.Carolina SB life the moderates (liberals) controlled everything. Finally, the conservatives won control. While the moderates were running the show they didn't budge an inch.When conservatives won the day all of a sudden the moderates wanted to "work together for the cause of evangelism putting aside the (non-essentials)". That my friends is impossible. All you will wind up with is a watered down, social Gospel. This may sound a little harsh but, just like in political circles liberals must be defeated in theological circles as well. There can be no "bridge building" If there is, the bridge will always lead to the slippy slope of liberalism.
    Conservatives in each state need to follow the example of Virginia SB and form their own state conventions and have the churches put their money where their mouths are so to speak.
    It will never happen though. That is because they must keep the convention machine rolling. That is the only thing I've had a problem with ever since I was young. Even today SBC will accomodate the moderates for the sake of keeping the National Conv. running smoothly. Its nothing like it used to be but that is still how it is to a degree.
     
    #10 shannonL, Jun 3, 2005
  11. USN2Pulpit

    USN2Pulpit New Member

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    Missouri Baptists have a "single-alignment" proposal that should come before the convention this year.
     
    #11 USN2Pulpit, Jun 3, 2005
  12. untangled

    untangled Member

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    Shannon,

    I understand where you are coming from. I go to a Southern Baptist church that is not affiliated with the CBF. Being from NC myself, I've seen alot of tension between CBF and SBC. The funny thing is that most of the churches that break up seem to break up over CBF related issues. For instance, there was a church that broke up not too long ago because the CBF supporters wanted to ordain a woman in a SB church..

    In my opinion, there are not any true moderates left. Its usually liberal or conservative.

    In Christ,

    Brooks
     
    #12 untangled, Jun 3, 2005
  13. Mike Stidham

    Mike Stidham Member
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    And the single alignment proposal, should it pass in Missouri, will probably catch on SBC-wide.

    The CBF'ers (and I are one for now) are everything folks on this forum say they are. They are forcing the issue of "doctrinal purity" by engaging in some semantic revisionism in order to say they are the "real" Southern Baptists.
    For the record, they're pitching but there aren't a lot of SBC'ers catching. Their strength is among older "First" churches with concentrations of retired missionaries and professors. They will soon dig their own grave.
     
    #13 Mike Stidham, Aug 30, 2005
  14. Gregory Perry Sr.

    Gregory Perry Sr. Active Member

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    Mike....I guess the question I have for you ...in light of what you just said is....Why are you still involved in the CBF? I don't think I'd want to take the chance of falling into that "grave" they are digging.For the record,most of my background is in IFB churches but I currently attend a non-CBF supporting small SBC church in upstate SC since that is where God led me back to fellowship with Himself after a long season of defeat and backsliding.My pastor is a conservative SBC fireball with a high regard for the Scriptures and a HOT love for Christ and lost souls.Don't stay in a dead church...come OUT from among them while you still have your witts.

    Greg Sr.
     
    #14 Gregory Perry Sr., Aug 30, 2005
  15. go2church

    go2church Active Member
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    The CBF is not apostate and it is silly to say so.

    So you where saved in a moderate/ liberal outfit, great! The "good ole SBC" used the 63 BF&M for years without any problems, did the church you grow up in have a different statement of faith then the rest of the SBC?

    Do you mean, Samford University (Birmingham, Alabama) home of Beeson or The Divinity School at Wake Forest in Winston-Salem, NC which I often get mixed up with Southeastern Seminary in Wake Forest, NC?
     
    #15 go2church, Aug 30, 2005
  16. buckster75

    buckster75 Member

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    There seems to be many different factions these days in the SBC. I saw the other day an article where a prof. at a SBC seminary in Texas encouraged a student to go with their "call" to be a pastor. problem I had was that the student was a woman. SBC (maybe just the BGCT) getting to liberal for me.
     
    #16 buckster75, Sep 6, 2005
  17. El_Guero

    El_Guero New Member

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    Buckster

    You gotta show me the article.
     
    #17 El_Guero, Sep 6, 2005
  18. Jimmy C

    Jimmy C New Member

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    Buckster cannot show you the article - as it does not exist. He uses the same tactic as was used countless times in the past to denigrate past SWBTS proffs, was not true then, is not true now.
     
    #18 Jimmy C, Sep 9, 2005
  19. untangled

    untangled Member

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    Here's my two cents...

    I am from an SBC church. My old church was SBC only. They did not have anything (at all) to do with the CBF. The CBF has all but thrown the Word of God down the drain. (I'm one of those ignorant people that believe the Bible is God's Word)

    Now I pastor an Independent Baptist church. I would much rather send my missions money to IMB of the SBC. I miss the SBC and my church is more aligned with the SBC in beliefs than with IFB.

    I personally still send money to the SBC for missions. I will continue to support them unless something very bad happens. I've seen some of the literature that IFB organizations send and it is all but amuzing to me. I agree with alot of the doctrine, however all they do is insult the SBC in every single newsletter I've been getting. Sometimes I think they should give it a rest.

    Just my opinion.

    In Christ,

    Brooks
     
    #19 untangled, Sep 9, 2005
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