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Featured Seeker Churches = Apostates?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by evangelist6589, Feb 11, 2015.

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  1. Rolfe

    Rolfe Well-Known Member
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    And some get bored when it goes late. :laugh:
     
  2. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    :laugh:
    If you think so

    :laugh:is the biggest indicator

    :laugh:that I'm on the right track

    -------->:laugh:
     
  3. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    I would rather pound my head into a cinder block wall while debating with DHK (who I do not engage anymore) than James. At lease DHK is not on both sides of the fence. James has invented a novel theology of his own. I call it "Jello Theology" because it is impossible to pin down.
     
  4. PreachTony

    PreachTony Active Member

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    RLB - I meant it more as a general joke about certain high-profile preachers. But I am somewhat serious, and I'll explain why. While we may vary on the idea of what constitutes an apostate, I believe each one of those I listed to be false teachers.

    Joel Osteen is one of the worst offenders. His self-help Christless Christianity is leading thousands and millions astray.

    Rick Warren has proven an even greater openness to working with those of varying faiths than Evan has stated I show. (For the record, I brought up the point that if a liberal church member came up with a good plan for working toward ending abortion, then it wouldn't hurt to consider working together to end it. I never said that we had to work together to evangelize people, as obviously we would be presenting differing gospels.)

    TD Jakes, for a long time, refused to affirm the Trinity, and instead presented a "oneness" philosophy about the nature of the Godhead.

    Creflo Dollar has propounded the "little gods" doctrine, stating that we are gods, because God established a system in which everything produces "after its own kind," and God produced man. He has said that, essentially, Adam could fly, or could be instantly transported from one place to another. He has said the God has set up planets for us to "finish" in our capacity as 'gods' in our "God Training 101."

    Joyce Meyer has preached a doctrine that Christ died on the cross (good), was placed in the grave (good), and was sent to Hell to be tormented by demons (tap the brakes, now) in order to complete the work of salvation (whoa!). Regardless your beliefs on where Christ went while His body was in the grave, to say he had to be tormented by devils to complete the work of the cross is to deny His very words on the cross of "It is finished."

    Paula White (not James White, I'm frankly not familiar with him), as you noted, is a proponent of the Word of Faith movement, yet people still follow her.

    And I left off Eddie Long, who had some pseudo-Jewish rabbi come on his show and crown him King and march him around the stage.

    Here's a Christian rapper (regardless your opinion of Christian rap) who calls out all these false teachers, to the point that Paula White's "ministry" responded to him...one day after the album went on sale:
    http://www.christianitytoday.com/gleanings/2013/april/reformed-rapper-calls-out-12-popular-pastors-as-false.html?paging=off

    As for Washer and MacArthur:
    MacArthur's promotion of Lordship Salvation, I fully believe, is a false teaching. We disagree on this, and we know it. I believe LS is a works-based salvation. MacArthur has said some things I agree with, but his continued lifting up of LS sets me farthest apart from him.

    Washer? You guys know my feelings on Paul Washer. I do not doubt his sincerity or tenacity, but he also promotes LS, to the extent that he has called an experience of grace nothing more than a "silly profession." He has called preachers who preach the pathway Paul laid out to the Romans "stupid evangelists" and "gospel reductionists."

    I'm sure we'll disagree on this. Yes, my original post was meant somewhat facetiously, but I believe the kernel of truth that was in it, from my point of view.
     
    #44 PreachTony, Feb 12, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 12, 2015
  5. PreachTony

    PreachTony Active Member

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    Just because I don't always agree with you doesn't mean my ideas are "weird." :smilewinkgrin:
     
  6. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    Royal priesthood, holy nation, peculiar people, brother.

    Don't shrink from it
     
  7. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I usually put people on ignore due to harassment and not to disagreement but to each his own. I once tried to debate James on the book "The Gospel According to Jesus" but James instead gave his book away and refused to read it cover to cover. I then suggested some easier books by Mac to read such as "Hard to Believe" because its very obvious James does not have much understanding on LS but he also refused. I concur that the Gospel According to Jesus is not an easy read, but Hard to Believe was meant for the layman.

    Perhaps you are correct on James Jello theology. He claims to know much about LS yet refuses to read books on the topic so he is hard to debate.
     
  8. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    John, that's the biggest load of crap, and you know it. You said COVER to COVER, but you wouldn't even address my concerns from the Forewords from the Gospel According to Mac.

    Yeah, I gave all my books away, just so I could run from your theological prowess. Just ask the other half dozen guys who got some of those books. I confessed to all of them what my true motive was

    You ought to be ashamed of yourself, brother.
     
  9. go2church

    go2church Active Member
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    Here is some news, the seeker church isn't even a thing anymore. Even Bill Hybels, the modern originator of seeker churches has said that type of church did some good, but was a model that needed to be abandoned.
     
  10. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I was talking about that one book which you refused to read cover to cover. Why? The other books were not all Calvinist so you gave them away with a good motive. You have attacked Mac yet have not read his book cover to cover.

    Look James this will be on me. I will buy you a copy of Hard to Believe (easier read) if you are willing to read it. But please do not attack Mac without qualifications in having read a LS book cover to cover.
     
  11. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    Lots of churches are seeker still
     
  12. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    I didn't refuse to read anything. I told you I you want to start on page 1, then go to page 2, then 3, that's cover to cover. But you insisted on trying to divert to chapter 4.

    I'm really not interested in hopscotching through favorite proof texts. I do that enough with the Mormons I meet with
     
  13. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    Then you cannot comment on LS since you know little about it. I am sorry but reading the preface is not the same as reading the entire book. Also Mac has well defended LS in that book and does not proof text! It's all in the bible!
     
  14. quantumfaith

    quantumfaith Active Member

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    Can someone explain to me, a simple man, what exactly "proof texting" is? As I understand it, it is offering a scripture to support whatever position one is arguing. Is this so? If so, why is it some are "proof texters" and others are not?
     
  15. Tom Bryant

    Tom Bryant Well-Known Member

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    proof texting is when someone else does it. Solid Biblical exposition is when I do it. :tongue3: :smilewinkgrin:
     
  16. quantumfaith

    quantumfaith Active Member

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    That is exactly what I suspected. :) Thanks for the clarification.
     
  17. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    What on earth makes you think I haven't read all the way through something MacArthur has written? Simply based on the fact that I disagree with him?

    I've told you at least a half dozen times I was a MacArthur drone until I reached the point I needed assurance
     
  18. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    A Johnny Mac Drone .....wow, how did that happen? I mean mentally....in what state of mind were you in? were you one of those young & restless Modern Calvinists with a list of Theological Mentors....Ive seen that happen. Now they got Paul Washer as the current prophet of the week.....before that it was Piper Yada Yada.
     
  19. Rolfe

    Rolfe Well-Known Member
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    Well said.
     
  20. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    I had just become a believer, after having been raised in a very works centered church. The FM Christian radio station (Bott Radio) pretty much only aired Reformed preachers during my listening time, plus I was wrestling with eternal security at the time.

    Those radio preachers (Mac, Sproul, Kennedy, etc) seemed to offer it. So I bit
     
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