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Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by Daniel David, Sep 5, 2002.
I just want to ask one question:
Was God responsible for September 11, 2001?
No, but He certainly chose to allow it to happen.
And I would assume that He wasn't just capricious in allowing it to happen, but that He chose to allow it to happen for a reason, for a good purpose.
I do not wish to argue against your post. I was not asking about whether God actively caused it or merely allowed it.
I was specifically asking if we can say that God is responsible for the event and all that took place that day.
Is this the STEAK you were referring to?
What exactly is the point of this thread? Where are you wanting to go with this?
No, God was not responsible for the cowardly acts of terrorism and murder of innocent lives on 09/11. Nor is He responsible for tornadoes, floods, hurricanes, or other acts commonly referred to as "acts of God" by the insurance industry or general population who don't know any better.
God is not the author of evil. What happened on 09/11 was evil.
[ September 05, 2002, 03:49 PM: Message edited by: SheEagle911 ]
God gets the credit for everything good that resulted from the event. Sinful men are responsible for any sinful acts that brought about the event.
It is impossible to talk about God and whether He is responsible, since "responsible" is a meaningless word when used in reference to God. There is nothing outside God to which He can be responsible--there is nothing above Him for Him to be held accountable to.
[ September 05, 2002, 03:54 PM: Message edited by: russell55 ]
So, sheeagle, if God was not responsible for 9/11, was He a victim? If He was not a victim, where was He?
BTW, you are the one who said your thread was meat. I did not. I have never claimed any of my threads were meat. What is your point? Stay on the subject at hand please.
God allows sinful man to have his own way to a point. In Gen. 6 as he looked upon the sinfulness of humans of that time he said "my Spirit shall not always strive with man" We find that judgment did come and only Noah and his family were saved.
Think of the Lord Jesus Christ who came into this world to his own people first and yet as a nation they rejected him. As he looked over the city he wept "If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy deay the things which belong to thy peace! but now they are hid from your eyes." Luke 19:41 We see that the Son of God wept at their rejection and did not force himself or his ways upon them.
Does God take sides in human wars?? In World War 2 there were Christians who went into battle from both Germany and England. They would pray to the same God for safety. Did God take sides? I think not, he allows humans to reap the consequences of their own actions.
What about Sept. 11? All people involved including the terriorists had souls, souls which God sees as precious. Nevertheless, when the horror of their actions were realized, both saved and unsaved went out to meet God. Why did he not stop it? We don't know the answer! We do know that as he looks down upon us in our misery, it is a look of love and an offer of salvation to those who will allow their wills to be broken before the cross of Christ.
No, God was not a victim. God has never been a victim nor will He ever be a victim. What puny man can make God a victim?
Jesus Christ, though crucified, was not a victim. He gave His life willingly. He could have called tens of thousands of angels to rescue Him.
Where was God?
God was there, in the midst of the evil and carnage, God was there. The other night on the History Channel they said 50,000 people worked in the WTC and on any given day there could be 200,000 people in the buildings. That day, was a voting day and many people were late for work. Some had gotten sick. Business was not as usual that horrible day, otherwise the loss of life would have been greater.
Someone gave an order to evacuate, but to this day, the History Channel reported no one knows who gave that order. Was it God? Did He use some unknown person to give that order? Did He give the order Himself?
Where was God? The fact the buildings stayed up as long as they did gives a tribute to the Hand of God. Why didn't they just crumble on impact? Could there have been unseen forces holding them up so many more people could escape?
Where was God? His angels were there leading all His children home to Him. He gave an added courage to the brave First Responders who went about their business trying to save lives facing their duties with bravery.
Where was God? He prevented the explosion from destroying all the escape routes and stairs so people could evacuate.
Where was God? He gave Todd Beamer and the others on Flight 93 the courage to make a difference and be heros when they knew they would die and they changed the course of that jetliner.
Where was God? Answering prayers offered in my living room for protection of our President, the White House, and Air Force One as Todd Beamers flight flew directly over our house headed back towards Pennsylvania and Washington DC.
Where was God? He was reflected in the hearts of all who gave so selflessly to provide sandwiches, coffee, cold drinks, ice water, a massage, a smile, a thank you to all the Rescue Workers who worked around the clock to find survivors in the crumbled twisted fiery ruins.
Where was God? He was reflected in the wail of bagpipes playing Amazing Grace as heros were memorialized and He gave comfort and strength to a Nation when grief was too much to bear.
Could God have prevented the tragedy of 09/11? Sure. God can always choose to step in and intervene in the affairs of men on this planet. Sometimes He chooses not to. After all, He gave mankind liberty to choose for good or for evil. He gave us a free will.
But a better question would be, How many times has God prevented tragedies such as 09/11 or greater from occurring to this Nation that we don't even know about and won't know about this side of Heaven?
Where was God? He was present in so many ways and we will never know all the answers or even know the right questions concerning His greatness and Love and Mercy this side of Heaven.
But this I know. I know the future is in God's hands. And am secure in knowing in whom I have believed and that there is nothing that can separate me from the love of God. And if He sees each sparrow that falls, He knew about this day, 09/11/01 long before it ever happened. God was not caught off guard. He was not surprised.
Is it possible God ordained and directed this event?
I would like to point blank ask: is it possible God wanted this to happen?
If a trumpet is blown in a city will not the people tremble? If a calamity occurs in a city has not the Lord done it? (Amos. 3:6)
I am not God, so I don't know.
It has been speculated by some that God removed His umbrella of protection from us as a Nation because we are so wicked (i.e., abortions, etc.).
It is not for me to say, however.
[ September 06, 2002, 06:23 PM: Message edited by: SheEagle911 ]
How many times have we, as Christians, prayed for a turning of the godlessness in this country? The impact on the people, when this happened, was unbelievable. When I heard the state of Wisconsin declaring all schools to honor prayer and acknowledge God, can these results be anything but from Him?
In Job, God told Satan to consider His servant, to the point of doing anything to him but take his life. I don't think it's unrealistic to make an assumoption that God wouldn't allow it to happen. How many of us wanted to see the US back on their knees, before God?
But, to say God was responsible, is saying He is to blame, which would cause people to turn away from Him. For Him to be responsible would be saying that He was trusted to do this as a duty, or to meet an obligation. God knows the difference between right and wrong, so who would have put their trust in Him to do this? If we are to say God was responsible, then we have to also blame ourselves for asking Him to turn this country around. It is sad to say, but tragedy does cause people to acknowledge Him. And to think that we are doing our job to convert the unsaved, then we shouldn't have to pray for the turning.
Maybe the question could better be asked...
"Are we responsible for giving God reason to allow this to happen?"
Why not? Most generally when disater happens, people want to hear abour God and even want to pray, and go to church.
But, it only last, until the fear wears off. But, I would venture to say that many were saved during each incident.
This also gives us an idea of the reality of how easily the Jews forsook God after each event. (Most of the times)
Look at us now, there isn't so much about God, anymore.
The following is from a discussion with Lisa Beamer: