Should I go non-denominational???

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by KPBAP, May 20, 2004.

  1. KPBAP

    KPBAP
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    I grew up in a Christian family, SBC to the core. Baptized at age 9, called to ministry at 18. Went to a Baptist college and attended 2 SBC seminaries and graduated from the 2nd one. Did denominational work for nearly 20 years. I have seen much controversy, heard and seen hurtful and spiteful things, all done for "the sake of the Gospel and 'Baptists'". I have seen many good Christian men and women hurt. Envy, pride and inflated egos abound. Then I became a statistic of the unemployed, and my departure was not very caring, let alone very Jesus-like. My non-Baptist friends have been the most supportive, caring and loving these several months.
    Lately it seems that Baptists are more "against" than they are "for" anything and are competing against one another.
    Can I be healed from the hurt, and then remain "one of them"? Shall I look elsewhere or become one of the growing disillusioned?? :(
     
  2. Bartimaeus

    Bartimaeus
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    KP
    Are you a Baptist because of your experience?
    Are you a Baptist because of your training?
    Are you a Baptist because of your peers?
    Are you a Baptist because of Biblical Conviction?

    Where will you go when these "new" Christians turn on you? They will.

    Thanks ------Bart
     
  3. Jailminister

    Jailminister
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    To be honest, I believe what the bible says. I am a Christian first, then a baptist by choice because traditionally they have been the closest to actual biblical doctrine. After reading what some on this board and another Baptist board believe, I am starting to wonder how our baptist doctrine ever got away from us. It must have been liberal cemetaries (I mean seminaries)
     
  4. Gina B

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    I've considered doing the same, but came to the conclusion that people are the same everywhere.
    I choose to stay in a baptist church.
    I have hope I guess. LOL I simply tell myself I refuse to be hurt by others, and that goes for my whole life anyhow.
    After a while you learn to do your best and not become angry when people don't listen.
    For example, in one Baptist church we had a day planned to get together. When deciding what to do with the time it was decided that we should have a pizza party. This upset me. I let it be known that we had enough time for this type of thing already and we should be getting together this next time to worship, or to visit the elderly, anything but more pizza and lame church jokes. Nobody listened and all my attitude did, right as my intention was, was drive people away and embarass them. On top of that I was then angry with them.
    Things like that serve as learning experiences.

    I've learned to control my emotions and understand people a bit more usefully. If this happened where I'm at now my approach would most likely be something like "Hey, you know we haven't been to the nursing home to visit so and so in a while, why don't we take the last half hour of our time and go say hi, unless you can think of something else we haven't done for a long time that needs to be done first."

    My point is you don't have to leave the church. We need all the good people we can get. We also can't expect them to change to suit us all at once. We can influence others to a very great degree though, and that's why I choose to stay in a Baptist church. It's not about them, it's about my God and me and I'd much rather try influence others toward good then leave and try to fit in with another group that doesn't believe the same things.

    There's good and bad people that can be Baptist or not. We tend to hold our fellow Baptists up to a higher expectation than we do our non Baptist or non Christian acquaintances, and I think that contributes to the higher level of hurt we feel when they do something we don't expect. We notice when an unbeliever does right because in our minds they're not supposed to, but we watch with an eagle's eye for our fellow brothers and sisters to step out of line because we think they're supposed to do right always.

    Gina
     
  5. KPBAP

    KPBAP
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    Thanks! excellent words!!! [​IMG]
     
  6. littlewhitedove

    littlewhitedove
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    I was gonna post on the subject but Gina said everything I was gonna say. Good job and I agree with you 100%. I had rather be a Baptist and attend where people go with inflated egos, than be a Morman with kisses and huggs at every turn.
     
  7. Pete Richert

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    I'm not really sure what this thread is about. Baptist is just a name (a broad name as this board has testified too) and I would hope you call yourself a baptist because your Biblical understanding leads you to agree with the majority of what the majority of baptists say. It would make no sense to become presbyterian because they were nicer if you weren't convinced that there theology was in line or as close in line with the Bible.

    As for non-denom, do you agree or will you agree with their theology and practice? If so, then by all means join, believing what they believe is what makes you fit, not allegence to the name Baptist which changes over the years and means many things to many people.

    I grew up in a Baptist church. Went to a Brethren church for 3 years in college which for all practical purposes is the same as an IFB (dispensational and conservative). I then went to a Bible church for a year and a half which carried the normal non-denom baptist beliefs. In graduate school I went to Calvery Chapel of which had differing views on charasmatic gifts then me as well as on over emphesis on arminisim (like most Baptist anyway). And now finnally I am back in a church that indentifies itself as Baptist (actually Reformed Baptist) which, strangly enough, though the first church I have been in that refered to itself as Baptist since high school is the most unlike the Baptist churches represented here because it is amillieniel.

    Unless you are landmark in beliefs, I don't see why you wouldn't try to indentify with the church of which you agreed taught the truth and not the name.
     
  8. Pete Richert

    Pete Richert
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  9. Johnv

    Johnv
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    KPBAP, generally speaking, I don't favor non-denoms, because there's no accountability for beliefs. The typical response is "we're accountable to the God", but the underlying core beliefs, such as a catechism, statement of faith, Distinctives, etc, are absent, or, in the very least, flexible enough to lack the accountability. For example, if an SBC church decides to abandon a Distinctive on its own, the SBC would slap their wrists and likely call them to adherence. That is notably absent in a non-denom.

    Now a denomination is by no means a cure-all for items of faith, but they're of great support for the same.
     
  10. Pete Richert

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    Of course, the problem is accountable to which doctrinal statement. Our friends on the presbyterians boards think we have all fallen away because we have not been accountable to the westminster statement of faith. Even today, on the Puritan Board, a poster commented that the errors of Dispensationalism (namely pre-trib pre-mill) beliefs would never have come about if we had submitted as we should have to the westminister confession of faith. But indeed, us Baptists believe the Bible teaches otherwise. How can you blame a non-denom if they find no organization of which they agree enough to then become accountable. They must believe the Bible.

    I don't think questions of denominations can ever be answered in this life. If we disagree about what the Bible says then we group ourselves in different churches whether we want to call them denominations or not. The early church probably had no conception of denominations like we do yet they had internal errors and were accountable to the apostles. Even then, some follow Peter, some follow Apollos, some follow Christ. Our only hope is Jesus's return or supernatural help from God for a whole generation of Bible intrepreters so that they all agree and all believers in Christ effectivily become a single denomination.
     
  11. massdak

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    find a baptist Church that has good fundamental, reformed and conservative to the bone. That is getting hard to do with so many types of baptist church doctrine from very liberal to biblical.
    i call on all liberal teachers and preachers to resign and leave their office.
     
  12. gb93433

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    That is simply not true at all. The state was aware, the local association and a former president of the SBC were aware of a situation I had to face in a local church. Some of the deacons were involved in a local Christian organization and they were in support of inviting the local Mormon bishop to come and preach. In fact they participated. I and one other pastor took a stand against this. Later it cost me my job as pastor. One of the men from the state spoke to them and told me there was nothing he could do all in the name of autonomy. The SBC is simply a lot of talk and no backbone.

    Bear in mind that I had spoken at a youth conference as the camp pastor. I was voted on by the pastors in the association to give the sermon at the annual meeting. I had spoken at other confeernces and did workshops. So it wasn't like I did nothing and complained.

    Truthfully I have been involved in non-denominational churches and SBC churches and have seen discipline taken more seriously in the non-denominational churches than what I experienced in the SBC. So I think it depends a lot on the individual church and not the denomination.

    Often the denominations do give more suport to the small church pastor though.
     
  13. KPBAP

    KPBAP
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    Basically, my cynicism of Baptist ministers continues to grow. I always thought that when a fellow believer was hurt or in need you sought to comfort and give him aid, not ignore him or just say "I am praying for you". There are many like me who are hurting and feel abandoned like the man on the road beaten and left for dead. The "priests" walk by....who will be the Good Samaritan? Several of my friends at church have lost their jobs. Does anyone try to help them network or even ask how they are getting by? NO!
    It is so easy pass on the other side.
     
  14. GeneMBridges

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    KPBAP,

    You will get as many different answers to this question as there are Baptists here on this board. Most of what I've read here is good advice, if not all, (I've skimmed it), so I'll not rehash that advice for you.

    I will say this. Pray. Pray. Pray. I also recommend this:

    Block out two or three hours in your day. Do a really, really good study of the Book of Acts. I say Acts because it is all about the first church. Try to answer these questions and any others like them that you can think of:

    What was the early church like? What place did preaching have in their life? What place did Scripture have in their life? How did they deal with moral lapses in their midst? How did they deal with conflicts (the Jerusalem Conference is a good example of how they resolved conflicts)? Describe the characteristics of their leaders, what kind of men were they? Any other questions. Write down your answers, and put a star or asterix beside those aspects that the Lord shows you apply to you and your particular situation. Be sure your answers reflect the early church "warts and all," and, remember some things, like the way they chose deacons by lot aren't meant to be models for us today. They are just included because, well, that's what they did. However, the picture in Acts is of the early church as a whole, and so it is overwhelmingly positive and great to use as the "model" kind of church we are to be. That's what you are trying to find out...what are the "ideals" a church is to be. That, with emphasis on what the Lord shows you as particularly significant for you and your particular situation is the KIND of church you should be looking for, regardless of denomination.

    If you want, go to 1 Corinthians and do the same study as a model of what kind of church of which NOT to be a part.

    You should always, of course choose a church that affirms orthodox, evangelical doctrine. You can find some good summaries at www.carm.org .

    Now, when prayer and what you learn in Scripture line up, take that, and the advice you've received as godly counsel here and anywhere else, as well as circumstances of your life and the things the Lord shows you through His Word that you need, and after you are sure that the Lord wants you in a particular church, then go there or stay, depending on what the Lord shows you. He may lead you in a direction you do not expect, and remember, it's not all about you. The Lord leads us into local churches that need us there not just to meet our own needs.

    Walk step-by-step and be patient. The Lord will lead you. That is His promise, not merely His wish for you. It is a promise He has made.
     
  15. dawna marie

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    There is no such thing as a perfect church you know the saying if you find a perfect church than dont join it it wont be perfect anymore. You just be faithful in what God has called you to do Be faithful to Him put him First , pray for His will concering you and where He wants you to do. and He will direct your steps with Him .

    May God Bless you
     

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