Should pastors have salaries?

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by rlvaughn, Jan 11, 2003.

  1. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn
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    This question is not whether pastors should receive any offerings, financial assistance, donations, etc., but should pastors agree to serve a church for a set salary, or in other words, XXX number of dollars every year (or every month or every week).

    IF SO, WHY?
    IF NOT, WHY NOT?

    [Perhaps I should define pastor for the purpose of this discussion - an ordained elder who serves a particular church (or churches) as their regular preacher/teacher. This might be one person, or in some churches more than one.]

    [ January 11, 2003, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: rlvaughn ]
     
  2. Grace

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    yes..they have to make house payments and eat. They also have to buy things like Toilet Paper and bleach and laundry detergent and toothpaste and soap...you get the picture. It is not fair to make them just depend on the goodwill of the people..if they make them mad one week, then what happens..umm...the pastor can't even eat spaghetti left over from last week because they couldn't afford to buy the stuff to make spaghetti last week... [​IMG] Sorry, yes, I do think that pastors should have salaries.
     
  3. jonmagee

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    Rivaugn, can you clarify?

    Are you exagerating to make a point?
    Do you mean literally no salary, or are you asking if money should not have a high motivation, as per 1 Peter chapter 5 ?
     
  4. Squire Robertsson

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    As we are instructed to do everything decently and in order, in 2003 that means our assemblies must needs have budgets. And if you are going to have a budget it makes sense to pencil in a number for the pastor's salary/housing allowence.
    In fact, the pastor's(s') housing allowence (which is non-taxable) must be voted on by the church.
    My home church last year had a budget of over 500k. Mind you that was slit up between the General, Missions, Sunday School, and Building budgets. Further, these numbers came not from any kind of "pledge" program ala the Presbyterians, but from the actual giving over previous years of our members. My home church is over 120 years old so tracking the previous years giving is fairly easy. As such, we plan out how much we will recompense our staff. There were times when our pastoral staff was prepared to take "tent-making" jobs. But, God, in His Providence, has always provided sufficent resources so we could keep our pastor(s) focused on their duties to our congregation.
     
  5. HeDied4U

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    17 The elders who rule well are to be considered worthy of double honor, especially those who work hard at preaching and teaching. 18 For the Scripture says, "You shall not muzzle the ox while he is threshing," and "The laborer is worthy of his wages." (1 Timothy 5:17-18 NASB)

    Should a pastor have a salary? YES

    God Bless!!!

    Adam [​IMG]
     
  6. rlvaughn

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    No.
    To clarify: Should a pastor enter into an agreement with a congregation such as - I will pastor your church for $400 per week. Or the church says - we will pay $30,000 per year. Or something like that - the agreement to serve or not serve for a stipulated amount of money. The question does not consider the motives of either the pastor or the congregation. Whether he is greedy or they are sincere does not enter into this question. I think most of us would agree that money should not be the motivation for pastoring.

    If the church and pastor should agree that he be paid a set amount, why should they?
    If the church and pastor should not agree that he be paid a set amount, why shouldn't they?
     
  7. Jim1999

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    My first church paid me £5. weekly and supplied a place to live. In this case it was a room in a member's home. And a means of transportation.

    My first church in Canada offered me $40.00 per week, but I was also a student. They also provided a motorcar and expenses.

    In another church, I worked as an architect and no church could match those earnings. In essence, I "paid" them to minister each week.

    Circumstances dictate the means. Essentially, I believe a labourer is worthy of his hire and should be paid a reasonable sum,,perhaps somewhere between the lowest and highest paid in the congregation, but each man according to his needs. This to is a witness to the community.

    On the other hand, the Plymouth Brethren have no paid clergy and they seem to manage.

    I suppose offering no salary would be one way to rid the overload in ministry; weed out the wannabe's from the would be's.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  8. Dr. Bob

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    I really like the bi-vocational "real world" pastor. Church pays some, but he also works just like others.

    Everyone in the church then must work to do what the "pastor is paid to do" in other churches. Like visiting, hospitals, etc.

    I am "part time" as interim and it gives me some time paid for study, counsel and preaching, but also allows me lots of time to continue working in the Clinic. And posting on the BB!! :rolleyes:
     
  9. Artimaeus

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    I had a longer answer but my browser crashed and I lost it. so, here is my answer in a nutshell. Either way is acceptable if agreed to by both parties. I would lean toward a set amount as this would allow him to plan for his family as we all do. If you are going to expect the man to give you full time ministry then you should expect to provide him with full time support. I don't think paying him to preach is a good concept, but, providing him with sufficient resources to allow him to minister full time is. The difference between those rwo concepts is whether you are paying him $80,000 or $30,000. I made up the numbvers just to illustrate whether you are supporting his work or supporting his lifestyle.
     
  10. tyndale1946

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    First of all can only speak for the Primitive Baptist brethren that I am associated with!... God called them and qualified them will he not also provide for them?... Will he not provide their every need? We do not pay our pastor a set salary as I don't believe it is biblical and I have known many pastors who worked a full time job and preached to and pastored more than one church.

    We do pay him according to the ability of the church to pay. I've heard it said Grace is free but the preacher is not. Our pastor travels about 120 miles to preach for us on the 3rd Sunday and we pay him for coming but we don't set a certain amount!... The scriptures state the Lord loveth a cheerful giver... btw Primitive Baptist don't tithe either... We don't give 10% but give according to our ability and sometimes it is less and sometimes more.

    I've heard in the past of Primitive Baptist preachers being paid with a chicken or maybe eggs and vegetables... Or after church because the church was poor brought to the home of a member and fed supper and given a little for gas. Then again I'm just speaking of our people... Maybe a few other on here... Maybe Brother Jeff can answer this question better than I can and a few of our PB brethren can elaborate more!... PBs to my knowledge have never set a salary for their pastors!... Brother Glen [​IMG]
     
  11. TaterTot

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    My husband is a pastor in a rural area. He is also a PhD student and works as a research assistant at the seminary an hour and a half away. We have two small daughters (under 2) and I teach private music lessons to be able to stay home. I also get a small salary for working with the kids at church. We still cannot afford insurance or a car payment. We do not live an extravagant lifestyle (no fine cars, no cable TV, etc) But we would NOT be interested in leaving here for more $ because God has called us here and is providing for our every need. We are hopeful that in a couple of years, my husband will be teaching at a Baptist college near here and still pastoring our precious church. Without the salary, though, (knowing we can count on having that fixed amount each week, we couldn't live a normal life (like being able to make a family budget). Paul had his needs met as he traveled and I cant see anywhere in scripture that speaks against salaried ministers.
     
  12. Pastor Larry

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    For those who oppose paying your pastor to preach and live, how do you answer 1 Cor 9 where the clear pastor is set that those who preach the gospel are to live of the gospel? The congregation is to step up to the plate and take care of those who take care of them. Consider also Galatians 6 and 1 Tim 5 both which argue the same point. It seems to me that the ones who argue that pastors should not be paid are out of line with Scripture.
     
  13. I Am Blessed 24

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    Hi Tater [​IMG]
    ITA with everything you said. My son is the Pastor of a small rural church (it's getting bigger!) and he and his wife have four children. He is on a salary but not a very big one. He did not go to that church because of the salary and he will not leave it because of the salary. He is there because he is in the center of God's will and that's where any Christian (Pastor or not) should wish to be. God called him to that church and he will stay until God calls him to another church. He also works part-time to supplement his salary.

    In my home church our Pastor receives a salary. He takes care of us and it is our job to take care of him and his family. On a salary he can preach what he wants and doesn't have to worry about stepping on toes or 'scratching itching ears'.

    Someone (who was opposed to salaried pastors) said in an earlier post that "God will provide". Yes, God will provide; but he does it through His people who are His instruments.

    There have been times when my son and his family set down to an empty dinner table and thanked God for the food they were about to receive. Guess what? The doorbell would ring and they would find bags of groceries on the doorstep!

    People had to buy those groceries and put them there; but it was still God providing. The problem is even though God still speaks to us today; some people aren't listening. :confused:
     
  14. massdak

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    no but they could recieve help as needed, the apostle paul didnt depend 100% on offerings. biblial commentary has stated this&gt; ministers must be more concerned about what they can give their flock than concerned about what their flock can give them&lt;&lt;
    a preacher can work and preach and do much for a flock without big salarys. many will probably disagree, but i see no plain biblical example of complete financial support of a preacher.
     
  15. Angie Miller

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    Yes I do think they should have a Salary. Yes in many cases their living expenses are paid to a certian point. It varies in situations I am familar with. But I feel that they have personal things they may want to use the money for and the Church need not know every single penny they spend and on what. They are in a position of trust as it is and in most cases I am sure they will spend their salaries on what is needed for their families. Like I said situations are different everywhere but I do think they should get a salary.
    Love in Christ Angie
     
  16. Abiyah

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    There are pastors who love a paid dictatorship.
    There are pastors for whom pastoring is a job.
    There are pastors for whom it is a definite calling.
    There are pastors who studied in school for years.
    Tthere are pastors who studied for 2 - 4 years.
    There are those who did not study in school at all.
    There are pastors who live for Sunday morning
    and hardly do anything for the congregation or for
    others otherwise.
    There are pastors who just do their jobs.
    There are those who give all they have to pastoring.

    I my 53.6 years, have had some of each kind listed
    above. In my opinion, they should be paid accord-
    ing to the way they choose to serve plus their ef-
    forts in training for their positions.

    Where I attend presently, I know of no one who
    works harder for the congregation, who is so inter-
    ested in seeing the congregation educated, or who
    seeks the congregation's right-standing before
    our God more than my pastors do. I have also
    never before had such highly trained and educated
    pastors as my present ones, although one is still
    in school.

    They deserve what they are getting, however it is
    given, and I am finally going to attend the next
    members' meeting, in order to be more privy on
    such issues.

    However, during a time when there were problems
    within the congretation, years ago when we had
    only one pastor, that pastor stood before the con-
    gregation and told us that we could pull together
    and be a real congregation, supportive of our
    leaders, or he could go back to what he was doing
    before he pastored. He is not dependent upon the
    existence of our place of worship for his living.
    He could be gone next week and working, sup-
    porting his family quite well.

    I do think this is the way it should be. If a pastor
    knows nothing but pastoring, then he is dependent
    upon that congregation for a living; thus, he is its
    pawn. What a sad state. Like Tator Tot's husband,
    he should be able to walk away, if it should ever be
    necessary, and be able to carry on.

    Furthermore, a pastor needs to know what it is like
    to worrk outside of the congregation's walls, for
    obvious reasons.
     
  17. jonmagee

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    I am a pastor who identifies with some of the things mentioned above.

    I came into full time ministry having had a well paid job, but sensing Gods call according to 1 Peter 5 which leads me to feel that finance does not determine the call.
    The current position would not be suitable if you were looking for monet equating with a career move, but it is Gods call, and that is more important.

    yours, Jon.
     
  18. Thankful

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    I definitely think that a pastor should receive a salary.

    God does expect us to take care of our pastors and I think the pastor of the church should live as well as his members.

    He may not receive as much as the richest person and perhaps more than the poorest person, but he should have a set amount of money that he can depend on.

    Yes, God has called him to do his ministry, but he has not called him to struggle and do without.
    God will provide his needs, but members of his church can give him a little more than he needs.
     
  19. Thankful

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    In my opinion, most pastors are not paid enough for the work that they do and for the work that the church expects them to do.

    I am very thankful for all the men who have answered God's calling to be pastors and grateful to them, many of which do not ever get the amount of money that they desire, but I am sure that they are storing away riches in Heaven for their works on this earth.

    I am also very thankful for the many deacons who are called to be servants without pay from the church.
     
  20. Refreshed

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    I have a problem with a pastor recieving a salary, although I can see no other way to do it other than what our church does. The preacher literally lives off of what is put in his side of the box in the back. He lives by faith. He is a great example to the congregation in this way, and the Lord has preserved himself and his family.

    With the absence of a way for God to preserve the pastor and his family's financial situation through the pastor's side of the box, such as the passing of an offering plate, I suppose there is reason to put a pastor on salary.

    Jason :D
     

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