Should we as Christians be celebrating the "Holy Days"?

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by the 'I AM' hath sent me, Oct 15, 2001.

  1. the 'I AM' hath sent me

    the 'I AM' hath sent me
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    I am a new Christian of two years. I am searching for the truth in the matter of the Holidays(Christmas, Easter, Valetines Day, etc.). Should we be celebrating these days, as Christians?

    I use the verse that says to test the spirits on everything I come across. I've searched the scriptures and can't find were we are to celebrate our Lord's birthday, or His resurrection. I've also found that these holidays are on pagan holidays.

    I find it interesting that us as Baptist, we stand on the fact that we didn't come out of the reformation. But yet we accept "holidays" established by the Catholic Church. We condemn the Catholic Church but then we uphold their "Holy" days.

    Are we no better than them? Do we make a mockery of Jesus Christ on these "holy days"?

    You know, it is hard to witness to the "witches" when you celebrate the same holidays they do. They laugh in our faces for such things.

    If anybody out there has some more to make this more clear to me. Maybe someone knows something in the Scriptures that makes these "holy days" o.k. Like I said, I am a new convert and I in no way know the entire Bible.

    The Lord is dealing with my heart on this issue and I need some advice.

    I come to my brothers and sisters in Christ asking you for your prayers and advice.

    Thank you in advance, a very confused and searching for the truth brother, Kenneth
     
  2. Chris Temple

    Chris Temple
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    This is a different subject - ;) - but who said "...as Baptist, we stand on the fact that we didn't come out of the reformation"?

    Although there were baptistic believers before the Reformation, I, for one, trace English Baptist history through the Anglican-Puritan-Separatist-Congregationalist-Baptist line; Landmarkers and Anabaptists excepted, of course :eek:
     
  3. Kiffin

    Kiffin
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    Actually these celebrations Pre Dated The Roman Catholic Church by 200 to 400 yrs. They were set up by the early "Catholic" Churches (Not Roman Catholic) of which all Christians were part of as alternatives to the pagan festivals and eventually superceded them. Do you think God is angry when we set a special day to remember the Incarnation or Resurrection? Use each opportunity you can to give God glory.
     
  4. the 'I AM' hath sent me

    the 'I AM' hath sent me
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    I don't understand the answers I have gotten so far. I am asking for Scriptural proof that it is o.k. to take a pagan holiday and make it Christian, as the Catholic Church did. I was not looking for an argument on if the Baptist Church came out of the Catholic Church, etc. The answer to that question depends on who you ask. I've heard both views. My post didn't mention the RCC, but yes that is who I was implying. Through my searching it was the RCC that instituted and Christianized the pagan holidays such as December 25, and even the day we celebrate Easter.
    All I am asking is can someone provide me with some proof that it is o.k. to celebrate these holidays, even though they were once pagan. And even though they were Christianized by the Catholic Church. The Baptists I know, of which I am one, strongly disagree with just about every Catholic doctrine that there is. Why do we accept the holidays the Catholic Church instituted? That is my point.

    Thank you and God Bless, Kenneth

    [ October 15, 2001: Message edited by: Bendecido por Dios ]
     
  5. Lorelei

    Lorelei
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    An interesting topic that was brought up in another thread. I am interested in what others find in scripture about this. It reminded me of the 14th chapter in Romans. Of course this is talking about Jews and Gentiles, some that regard the Sabbath more esteemed and some that regard some meats acceptable and others that do not. But it may apply to your question too. For it says that it doesn't matter if we regard one day over another as long as one "does so to the Lord". What do you think?

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>
    Romans 14:1
    Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters.
    2
    One man's faith allows him to eat everything, but another man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables.
    3
    The man who eats everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has accepted him.
    4
    Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.
    5
    One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind.
    6
    He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    ~Lorelei
     
  6. Joey M

    Joey M
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    Amen, Lorelei. I agree, if you are celebrating the holiday to give glory to God then by all means do it. And if you are not celebrating the holidays to give glory to God, then by all means don't.
    Now I would have to say, when Christmas rolls around, my children don't hear about Santa Claus or reindeer from me. What they hear is about the birth of our Lord Jesus Christ. And why we give gifts is representing the gifts that the wise men gave unto Jesus. Same with Easter they don't hear about an easter bunny, but rather that we celebrate this day because our Lord Jesus rose from the dead on this day and therefore He is able to give us life also.
    Now as for helloween, the only thing me and my family do is hand out tracts to those that stop by.

    God speed.
     
  7. Helen

    Helen
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    I hope the following will be of a little help here:

    Going back to Adam and Eve -- or maybe just to Noah -- all men knew the truth of God, man's sin, and God's promise of redemption. There is (highly disputed) evidence that it may have been 'written in the stars':
    http://www.ldolphin.org/zodiac/

    Whether or not the 'Gospel in the Stars' is acceptable to you, we know that Noah was a righteous man and told his children the truth. One of the ways we know that the truth came down is that we can find it in the most ancient of the Vedas, for example.

    What I am getting to is this -- it would not surprise me a bit if the original holidays were actually godly, and then pre-empted by paganism! They have certainly done that with things as simple as the circle and triangle!

    But let's put that aside as well, and look at history a little closer up -- about the time of Christ. We know Christ was the final and real Sacrificial Lamb of Passover. So we know the timing of the Resurrection. However the calendars did not get settled for many years after that and gradually the Jewish Passover, which is counted by the moons, diverged somewhat from the Christian celebration of the Resurrection. Occasionally they still coincide, but they are based on two different calendar systems.

    It was no accident that Passover and the Resurrection are springtime events. Christ IS the New Life. Spring itself is a picture of that. The pagan celebration of this new life, divorced from God, is properly viewed as something lost, not something substituted. We are the ones who can restore it to its real meaning. When my children were little, we explained the difference to them regarding the Easter holiday, and we chose to call it Resurrection Sunday, in honor of our Lord. They quickly caught on to the fact, as well, that Easter candy was half-price the day after Easter and were more than willing to pig out more cheaply afterwards! (Same goes for Hallowe'en and Christmas, by the way...)

    Is there something Biblical about Easter? No, not at all. But the Resurrection is the fulfillment of the promise built into spring itself, and our celebration of our Lord's defeat of sin and death deserves true celebration.

    Christmas is the same, but there is even more to it. First of all, the pagans recognized the 'birth' of the sun as the winter days turned the corner from shortening to lengthening. The fact that this timing works quite well with celebrating the birth of the true Light of the World is not coincidental, but there may be far more to it than is commonly known. December 25 is NOT the day Christ was born. We know that. But it may very well be the day the men from the East first saw the Child. An incredible analysis of this and the harmonization of history, astronomy, and Biblical exegesis was done by Barry Setterfield on this subject here:
    http://www.ldolphin.org/birth.html


    The commercialism involved in these holidays is the world trying to profit off of something incredibly holy and wonderful. That is there way. It is not ours. How we celebrate our Lord's birth on earth and His Resurrection is up to each of us and the Lord, but it sure shouldn't look the same as the world, or who is going to know we are different? Who will ask the questions to which we have the answers?
     
  8. the 'I AM' hath sent me

    the 'I AM' hath sent me
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    The basis on which you state your views don't hold water. IF that is all that you can come up with, I'd have to believe the other side of the coin. Can no one give account of why we believe the way we do as Baptist?

    There are a couple of sites I'd ask you to visit and see what you think of them. www.jesus-is-lord.com/christm3.htm

    I am seriously seeking a True answer. What these sites as well as others, are backed up by Scripture and make sence. What you all have said is not backed up by Scripture and seems like a traditionalist view instead of a Biblical view.

    Help me understand.
    A confused brother, Kenneth :confused:

    [ October 15, 2001: Message edited by: Bendecido por Dios ]
     
  9. Joey M

    Joey M
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    Bendecido por Dios,
    I have been to this site and none of the scripture they give has anything to do with Christmas at all, or easter either for that matter. These are verses taken out of context to prove thier point of view. Now is commercialization of these holidays right? No! But what Helen said here fits right in with scripture. If you are looking for a specific scripture that says celebrate or don't celebrate christmas, you are not going to find it. Again I say if you can do something and do it to the glory of God and God be glorified in it then where is it wrong? However if you do it just to be doing it or because that's what the pagans do, then yes I agree it is wrong. From your replies I can already see that you are bias to the option of celebrating these holidays. I don't put that view down, but there has been ample evidence given here why it is alright if done in the right way and with the right intent and you have said that we have not been suffient in convincing you. As I said before you will not find a direct scripture one way or the other suporting or condemning the holidays. I chose to give glory to God for the birth of my Lord and the resurection of my Lord. I do that all the time, but also putting aside a day for the sole purpose of it shows my thanks to Him. And you can condemn it 'till the cows come home, it wont change the fact that to God be the glory.
    You decide.

    God speed.
     
  10. preacher

    preacher
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    Kenneth:
    Don't know if this helps any but:
    Ro 14:22
    Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God.
    Happy is he that condemneth not himself in
    that thing which he alloweth.
    Ro 14:23
    And he that doubteth is damned if he eat,
    because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever
    is not of faith is sin.
    We know Paul was speaking of "meats' here but it can be applied to any aspect of the christian walk we encounter.
    You won't as others said, find where the Word says to honour these days. But I've never felt any condemnation in my walk for celebrating them in the spirit that honours
    our Saviour. If you say within yourself, within your spirit, "I can't do this by Faith, then don't do it, & don't worry what anyone else does or says.
     
  11. Helen

    Helen
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    Bendecido por Dios,

    Thank you for your response. The bottom line of all of it is to follow the Holy Spirit's leading in your life. In our family we have emphasized strongly the holy aspects of these celebrations, and the children understood.

    But if there is something that truly bothers you, it is not us you need to bring it to, but the Lord.

    Very often a new Christian has a hard time separating what is worldly from what is holy to God, and any of us who are past the beginning years probably understand what you are saying. I certainly do.

    I will say this -- as you mature in the Lord (and that's NOT a downhill slide!), there are some ways in which you will find greater and greater freedom as your relationship with Him becomes more firm in your own heart (it's quite firm in His...).

    But each of us has come to the Lord from our own individual points. The Holy Spirit is leading us all to the final Destination -- to be conformed to the image of our Lord Jesus Christ. But, in the process, we are going to be led individually, and only God Himself knows what you need for your spiritual well-being and growth and what lessons are going to be important for you. This seems to be an important issue for you. That makes sense. You want to stay true to God, and I can only applaud that.

    Please follow the Holy Spirit in this. Someday -- some fine and wonderful day -- none of us will any longer be seeing through a glass darkly, but we will see clearly. Then we will understand how He led us, and why, and we will see the truth of so much that we are grasping for now. But we all know this -- in Christ is all Truth. So stay really close to Him and give Him all this in prayer. He is faithful. You will get the right answer at the right time.

    God bless you.

    Helen
     
  12. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob
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    If you desire to celebrate the resurrection or the birth of Jesus, I would say "go for it". <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>"God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.

    Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Colossians 2:13ff
     
  13. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946
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    I celebrate these various holidays but I don't WORSHIP them... That is where the difference is... Also when you Worship these their are various deities other than God associated with their observance... Brother Glen
     
  14. the 'I AM' hath sent me

    the 'I AM' hath sent me
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    Thank you all for your insight. As I deal with things that I come across, such as celebration of the holidays, I quess I disect things too much. I am impatient and I want it now, so to speak. I realize that God will show me what is Truth, but in His Time not mine. I was discussing this issue with my wife last night. I am still unsettled in the issue, but I will leave it in God's hands. I did not mean to offend anyone here, I just do not want to do anything that would bring shame to my Lord.
    Another thing is I am so against the Catholic Church and its idolitrist worship that anything I hear came from the Catholic Church I want to get rid of. Maybe that is why I want so much to not celebrate these holidays. But then I think about the Christmas plays and the Easter plays in which many people have gotten saved because of the messages portrayed through them.
    So, I pray to the Living God for my answers.
    I ask you all to continue praying with me on this. That God in His Vast Wisdom, would somehow comfort me in this time of confusion in my life. Again, thank you all for your replies, and I do appologize for some of my remarks. God Bless you all, a young brother still confused but trusting in his Saviour, Kenneth

    P.S. Great to hear from you Preacher, hope all is well with you and your family.
     
  15. preacher

    preacher
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    It is Brother, & you've still never e-mailed me like I requested on a previous thread!! :eek: :rolleyes:
     
  16. Jamal5000

    Jamal5000
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    Hi Bencio,

    This is a very interesting topic isn't it?
    This subject was somewhat brought up on a thread called "Halloween".

    Whenever I have questions about Christmas or any of the other "Holy Days", I always go to

    1 Corinthians 10:14-11:1

    It should answer many of your questions.

    I just have a one comment about that Christmas article that you linked to. I notice that there were a number of very old books and encyclopedias from the late 1800s and early 1900s listed as sources. Please be very, very weary of these, especially Alexander Hislop's "Two Babylons" which was printed I think in 1873. Its scholarship is supposed to be notoriously corrupted and many of its ideas are atrociously inaccurate and out of date.

    Please try these more current books with much more up-to-date scholarship:

    --The Winter Solstice : The Sacred Traditions of Christmas by John Matthews and Caitlin Matthews

    --Celebrate the Solstice : Honoring the Earth's Seasonal Rhythms Through Festival and Ceremony by Richard W. Heinberg

    --Christmas Customs and Traditions : Their History and Significance by Clement A. Miles

    --Decking the Halls : The Folklore and Traditions of Christmas Plants by Linda Allen


    God Be With You!

    [​IMG]
     
  17. the 'I AM' hath sent me

    the 'I AM' hath sent me
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    Thanks Jamal for that link. It did help. The Lord is showing me His Will and I thank Him for that.

    I do have one disagreement though, the two Babylons. I've never read this book, but a missionary friend of mine has and he trusts what this book says. I quess I'd have to read it for myself to see what I personally think of it.

    Again, thank you all for your help with my delima. Praise God, for His Light Shines so Brightly.

    God Bless you all and keep you, Kenneth
     

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