simultaneously saint and sinner

I disagree. Sin, by nature, is an act of rebellion against God. When a Christian sins, they are rebelling against God at that time. God, who has already forgiven all our sins, does not abandon us, he convicts us and calls us back into fellowship with Him. If we persist in sin, God still does not abandon us, he progressively chastens us until we repent. Although it may appear that we have gotten away with disobedience, we have not. We will reap what we have sown, Christian or not. Then it becomes evident that although forgiven, sin always brings about negative consequences in our lives.

 

Yes, there you go Snow Man, I agree with you totally. That conviction is a really nagging pain in the neck cause you just cant, cant do it anymore. Suddenly there is this morality that never was there before. You sit there & you try to rationalize it....but I did it before, so why cant I do it now....its a real killer. You walk away from the sin talking to yourself...lol. You walk away saying "What has changed, what has changed" & all the time you know.

 

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

That sums it up perfect without any fancy definitions.

 

I don't disagree with how God handles the sin of a believer, but to say that a Child of God is a sinner is not an accurate designation. We are saints even when we sin and no believer ever returns to the practice of sin according to scripture.

 

I can think of a fleetwood mac song that applies perfectly here.....

 

Never met the guy, but what rules is not some heathens music, but rather the word of God.

 

What is the definition of "practice" of sin? Does one sin do it, or maybe two. Does it take one day of sinning or one week? This is difficult to say.

I don't think we can define it that way. I have know Christians who have spent years away from God, but they did return. Then the bible talks about a sin unto death. This would appear to mean that a Christian who would not return to God would eventually be taken to heaven early.

1 John 3:9 the Word of God says that God's seed remains in the Christian, therefore he doesn't sin. The real Christian nature is not to sin. When a Christian sins they are doing what is against their nature. Like Paul said Romans:

21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good.
22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man.
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death?
25 I thank God--through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.
Romans 7:21-25 (NKJV)

Notice, Paul doesn't say I am evil, he says evil is present with him. The real Christian, the seed God implants does not sin.

This may appear to give license to sin, but like I said earlier, to sin brings a bad harvest which causes grief to enter our lives. Ask any Christian who has spent years in sin if it was worth it in the long run.

 

What you are proposing is the same false doctrine that any Gnostic proposes. The spirit is holy and cannot sin and what the flesh does, it does not effect the spirit.

The passages you lifted out of Romans is not about Paul literally practicing sin as a believer. He makes it clear in the word he was blameless while under the law (Phl 3:6) so he did not get saved and suddenly start sinning. Also no Christian lives in sin (practices sin). 1John 3. it is impossible.
The designation sinner for a Christian is not biblical. We are saints that will sin on occasions, but we remain saints, not sinners. Sinners are the lost not the saved.

 

No, I'm not Gnostic, nor am I advocating that a Christian should sin. It seems you only read the parts you can argue with. On almost every thread you find fault and try to argue with the poster no matter who it is or what they say. You seem to think that you are the only one who is ever correct, and that your interpretation is flawless. Therefore I will leave you to argue with yourself. Have fun!

 

Thank you robert. As long as you understand that a Christian is not a sinner by calling. :wavey:

 

Go back through the posts and you wll have your answer.

 

Anyone on this side of heaven who thinks they have ceased their sinning is very very deceived. They are living in a fantasy world.

 

And anyone who is practicing sin and thinks that they are saved also lives in a fantasy world.

 

freeatlast...

Then we are all doomed.

Heaven, for all eternity, will be populated by the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

None of us make it.

But thats not the way it is, is it?

You see, you seem to be determined to cling to some degree of self rightiousness

In other words...

"Yes, I still sin. But MY sin is accidental. Dang it, I slipped up and *accidently* sinned, but I didnt do it intentionally like those wicked hell bound sinners do. I slipped up, so I get a pass, but those wicked ones over there, they are doomed."

I;m sorry, but that gobbledegoop wont cut it.

Friend, if it werent for Gods grace and mercy, that has been extended to us through the sacrifice and work of Jesus Christ, your "accidental" sin would send you to the same hell that that someone elses lifetime of deliberate sinning would get.

Sin is sin.

And Christs salvation is extended to all...by grace through faith, wich results in the new birth.

Habitual sin...accidental sin...little sin...big sin...it has ALL been atoned for at Calvary.

From Isaiah 53...

Where do you see any distinction regarding "accidental" sin and "willfull sin in there?

ALL sin has been atoned for, through Christs complete and magnificent work on our behalf.

Praise God for ever more!!!

 

[This] I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

 

How many sins does a person have to commit before they are guilty of practicing sin?

 

It's not a matter of the number of sins but of an impenitent and rebellious heart. This would be the state of an unbeliever.

 

[SIZE=+0]Amy is correct. The 1John 3 passages are not about time or even particular sins or even amount of sin. Many lost people are very good people and seem to sin at a low rate, but they sin with impunity. In other words the sins they do is never dealt with by them. No remorse or turning from them because it is their character. Our character determines what we do.
If we are born again we practice righteousness. If we are lost we practice sin. It is out of character for a Christian to sin. For a lost person to sin it shocks no one, not even themself. Some justify it as being such a small sin it really does not matter. No four letter words and really filthy jokes, just an occasional three letter word and a smutty joke. Then there are those who just let it all hang out. For a Christian to sin it shocks everyone around them and especially the Christian who did the sin. A true born again believer cannot practice sin. Sin for a Christian is out of character and our daily lives gives evidence of who we are, saved or lost. If we sin as a Christian we are immediately dealt with to confess it and turn from it. A Christian does not sin with impunity.

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