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Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Amy.G, Feb 2, 2011.
What exactly is the "sin nature" and where did it come from?
Sin nature (I actually like the term "flesh") is the parasitic effects of sin on our lives that are a result from the fall. We inherit this nature and are born into sin and, even after redemption, struggle with putting to death the things of the flesh.
I see the sin nature as nothing more than human nature affected by the curse. Sinners and saints are both human, walk upright, talk, socialize, play, are under the curse, will sin if not named Jesus, etc. One group is controlled by sin while the other is no longer.
Normally, I "stop" reading when a writer says something to the effect "God spoke to me"....but the following article I found interesting and worthy of thought and discussion.
some say inherited from Adam, so it came from Adam.
Totally unrelated and purely for entertainment and a chuckle.
Don't make me go ninja on yall.
No sir! I'm sceeered of that judy chop! :laugh:
But what do you say?
How did it come from Adam? Is it through the DNA?
How did Christ avoid it if it came through the flesh?
The fallen nature, or sin nature is inherited from Adam.
I don't know, and I'm not going to play scientist.
Because Christ is not a created being, like Adam, or Lucifer.
The first man (Adam) is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
1 Cor 15:47-49.
It comes through the father, thus the virgin birth. It is the very nature of man but Christ gives us a new nature :thumbs:
Many various definitions may be offered, but I think its important that the definition draws the distinction between a "sin nature" and a "hardened/calloused heart," because some theologians appear to miss that clear difference by teaching that all men are born totally unable to willingly believe God's revelation, whereas that is clearly the characteristic of a hardened nature, not merely a sinful one.
Not only does scripture bare this out (i.e. Acts 28:21-28) but personal experience also backs up this premise. How many of us have witnessed to children and met much less resistance to the gospel than we do when sharing the same message with adults? Why? They have not yet grown hardened to it.
Christ told us we must become like a child to enter his kingdom, but if a child is born Totally Depraved then what makes his nature distinct from that of any adult? The distinction between a hardened heart and a sin nature is very important in this discussion.
Does that mean that Mary is not (in the physical sense) His mother?
So you are saying that we inherit the sin nature from our father but not our mother? Is that correct? Is it through the father's DNA? Is it through the physical body of the father?
This has been a nagging question for me for many years. I don't know if I will ever find the answer or if God even wants me to, but I keep trying to understand it.
In a sense yes but in a sense no. Animals have DNA too, but they do not inherit a sin nature for they were not made in the image of God. When man was created he was created as a tripartite being: body, soul, and spirit. In Genesis chapter one, we find that animals have body and soul, but not spirit. Man has a spirit in which he can communicate to God. This is the big difference between man and animals.
Is the sin nature in the spirit of man or in the DNA--, that is the actual flesh. To say the actual flesh, then if my leg is amputated is part of my sin nature removed? No. So that theory does not make sense.
If the sin nature has affected the spirit of man, has corrupted his nature, then that makes better sense. It is not DNA, per se, but the very life that God has given man, that man cannot reproduce in a test tube. It is the life that only God can give. All life comes from God. The sin nature is passed on through the spiritual part of man. His spirit has been corrupted by the fall.
" Is it through the father's DNA? Is it through the physical body of the father?"
Good question, let me know what you figure out. :thumbs: Rather doubt it is in the dna but really have no answer for that one as yet.
Your argument is based on the notion man being tripartite is truth, when in fact Scripture does not teach that. I believe man to be material and immaterial, and that soul and spirit are used interchangeably in Scripture. Even man's DNA is affected by sin.
I'm with you on this. I've teetered from Christ not being "fully" man having used the virgin birth as my reasoning, to stepping back and recently not being so sure. To be fully human and tempted in every way as we are sure sounds like full humanity in the sense we know it. The thing is, He is fully God, too, so even having a sin nature does not mean He would be guaranteed to sin as we who are not also divine are assured of. Who knows, my view might change again on this since Scripture is not iron clad on this.
This really is a difficult subject. Thanks for all the replies!
Was Christ, in the physical sense, Mary's offspring? Did He share her genes? Or did God place Christ in her womb without sharing anything genetically with her?
This is not correct. Original Sin teaches the sin nature is passed through the flesh, and Jesus shared in the flesh of his mother Mary.
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and HER SEED: it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his head.
Here we see Jesus fully inherited the flesh of his mother Mary. His flesh was exactly like ours with the same lusts and desires.
The Catholics fully realized the serious problem Original Sin presented, if we inherit a sin nature through the flesh from our parents, then Jesus would have been born with a sin nature. This is why they invented the Immaculate Conception which says Mary was born without Original Sin.
We are born flesh, and so was Jesus. The flesh has lusts and desires (concupiscence) but is not sinful itself. Augustine himself agreed with this and said we are born with concupiscence, an inclination or propensity to sin, but this is not sin itself, sin being something that has to be committed.
Later, some went beyond Augustine and said we inherit sin itself through the flesh.
We do not inherit our soul and spirit from our parents, they come from God. We are made upright (Ecc 7:29). This is why the scriptures say we have all like sheep GONE ASTRAY. You cannot go astray from the flock unless you were originally in the flock.
We all become sinners when we allow ourselves to be drawn away of our own lusts and enticed. When we consent to and obey these lusts we sin with death as the result (James 1:13-15).
Well, the Bible clearly says she IS her mother.
But mother is a relative word.
It could mean somebody who bore a child in her womb for 9 months and then took care of that child afterwards until the child grew.
It could mean somebody who adopted a child and then acted as its mother all throughout its life.
In our natural conception, the mother contributes to the birth process through her eggs and the father through his own "processes".
However, Jesus' conception (is that even the right word ? lol) is definitely miraculous, but that's as far as I will go.