Sola scriptoria

Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by 33ad, Aug 5, 2012.

  1. 33ad

    33ad
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    If we all truly agree that we are able to inteprate the bible for our selves

    And someone thinks there are three different gods
    The father
    The son
    And the holy spirt

    What authority does anyone have to tell the other not to be a polytheist?? And not a triune monotheist. Because with out assistance in 10,000 years if a space alien found the bible on a drifting human space ship he could think Christians are polytheist

    This is just one example that questions sola scriptora

    James 2:24
     
  2. John of Japan

    John of Japan
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    I see that you are very unfamiliar with the Scriptures. The Bible is very clear, stating explicitly in many passages that there is only one God (NT only: Mark 12:32, Rom. 1:30, 1 Cor. 8:6, Eph. 4:6, 1 Tim. 2:5, James 2:19, etc.). So anyone who suggests that the Bible teaches there are 3 gods is just plain ignorant of the Bible.

    I suggest that you get some good Bible software that does searches well (I suggest the low end PowerBible CD), and check things out before making such statements. Do a search of "one God" and you can easily check it out. There is also a free download Bible software that could help you here at www.e-sword.net.

    The truth is that there is no group in all of Christianity that believes there are three gods. However, there are heretical groups that doubt the trinity: oneness Pentecostals, Jehovah's Witnsses, Mormons, etc. But the trinity is easy to defend from the Bible.
    To Baptists the authority is in the Bible, not a person. Baptists believe in the priesthood of the believer, the privilege each believer has to interpret the Bible on his or her own.

    Another of the Baptist distinctives is "the Bible as sole rule of faith and practice." So a Baptist would take the space alien to the many passages that teach the trinity.
    This verse does not question sola scriptura (not scriptora). This is basic theology. James was saying that we are justified in the eyes of men by our works, not in the eyes of God.
     
    #2 John of Japan, Aug 5, 2012
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  3. 33ad

    33ad
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    I don't believe that I am a monotheist trinitarian, my point is you need to be a scholar to understand the bible It's not easy. I have spent 3,000 hours reading it and I still don't understand certain things
     
  4. John of Japan

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    3000 hours? Is that all? I've read and studied the Bible since I was a little boy, have BA and MA degrees in Bible, have taught it in Japanese at two Bible schools, have translated the entire NT from Greek into Japanese, and I STILL don't understand much that is in it. :type:

    Two points.

    (1) The Bible is inspired by God, literally "breathed out" by God. If you could easily understand God's Word He wouldn't be much of a god--no more complicated than a Shinto god that lives in a tree with a rope around it and is worshipped by a few Japanese. The Bible is complicated precisely because it tells us about the eternal, infinite God.

    (2) The Bible should be spiritually understood, and it doesn't take a scholar to do that. You must depend on the Holy Spirit Who you have within you as your Teacher: "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you" (John 14:6).
     
  5. Yeshua1

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    one first MUST be born again, and have the Spirit in order to understand the bible, for he was its Author!

    Also, one must read and interprete it based upon the plain and literal meaning intended for each text, taking into account the differing genres/writing styles, and also taking in context and the whole scriptures on a given topic!
     
  6. Van

    Van
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    Hi 33AD, good for you as you study scripture. The idea of scripture alone is that we rely upon scripture as we understand it, rather than scripture as we understand it plus other sources for faith and practice such as the traditions or doctrines of Baptists or Catholics or Calvinists.

    Today we also deal with those that claim they are relying upon scripture alone, but what they claim agrees with some verses and disagrees with others. So they nullify those that point to the possibility of an incorrect understanding. This too violates scripture alone.

    Now lets consider the doctrine of the Trinity, One God in three Persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. You do not have to look too far to find several verses that clearly teach monotheism, there is only one God in the Bible. So our problem rests in the doctrine that Jesus is God and the Father is God and the Holy Spirit is God.

    Now there are two major mistaken doctrines that oppose the Trinity view, that Jesus is not God, and the Holy Spirit is not a Person. However, there are plenty of verses that teach that Jesus is God and that the indwelt Holy Spirit exhibits the three essentials of personhood - intellect, will and emotion.

    Now when I say Scripture alone means relying upon our understanding of scripture, this does include our inferences based on what we see as logical necessity. So when we read John 1:1-14 we are driven by logical necessity to conclude Jesus is God, yet Jesus clearly said He was sent by God the Father. So just by meditating upon Jesus was with God and was God, we have to come to grips with a problem, two persons but only one God. It is a longer trip but by study we can also find references to the Holy Spirit as communicating with Jesus, so we end up from scripture alone with one God in three persons.
     
    #6 Van, Aug 6, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 6, 2012
  7. reformed_baptist

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    I didn't think any christains thought that, and that is not sola scriptura, not by a long shot, no we believe the Holy Spirit leads us into all truth as we read the word of God because these things are spiritually discearned!

    Well we would point them to Deut 6:4 and ask them if they had actaully read the bible?

    No we get close to the point of Sola scriptura, no one has the authority to tell anyone what to believe, all we can do is tell them waht the bibles says - the authority is in the word of God, not in what we tell people to believe!

    He could, but then even Peter speaks about the way people twist scripture to their own ends does he not?

    No this is one example that questions a strawman sola scriptura.
     
  8. Van

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    Hi 33AD, I had a couple of additional thoughts concerning your opening post. A study bible may help you, but get one that is easy to read, like the NKJV or the HCSB. I use the 1995 Version of the New American Standard Bible with Zondervan study notes.

    Next, consider entering a discipleship program. One that is not so high on indoctrination but is high on teaching how to study the Bible. It should introduce you to some Bible study tools, such as a good dictionary, a Bible dictionary, an exhaustive concordance, and an interlinear.

    God Bless

    Van
     
  9. 33ad

    33ad
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    How do you think the lds became polytheist using a bible??
     
  10. John of Japan

    John of Japan
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    Who are the Ids??
     
  11. mandym

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    1Co_2:14 The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.
     
  12. Michael Wrenn

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    He means the Latter Day Saints (Mormons), I believe.
     
  13. John of Japan

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    Aha! Thanks, you're probably right. Capital letters would have helped: LDS.
     
  14. John of Japan

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    Assuming you mean the Latter Day Saints, by no means did they get their "theology" from the Bible, as witnessed by their need to have another sacred book, the Book of Mormon. They consider the Bible and the Book of Mormon to be the two staffs of Zech. 11, needing both for their teachings. If the Mormons had gotten their theology from the Bible, they wouldn't have their pseudo polytheistic beliefs. The Bible is crystal clear on monotheism.

    And as long as we're on the subject, I don't know what you've been taught, but the idea that monotheism developed after polytheism is a myth of secularizing scholars. One of many proofs of this (along with Hebrew monotheism) is the development of Chinese religion from the monotheistic worship of Shang Ti to polytheism.
     

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