Some Questions

Discussion in 'Pastoral Ministries' started by Rippon, Mar 11, 2007.

  1. Rippon

    Rippon
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    # 1 : Are people who come to worship before the service quiet in the sanctuary ? Or do most continue talking and laughing until just the moment before it is scheduled to begin ? I want to see if this is a common thing in churches or not . I think that too many may be socalizing in the guise of fellowshipping . They should be remembering that they are coming into the presence of the Lord and to offer up praises to Him .

    # 2 : How long has it taken a preacher to even mention a Scripture when "preaching " ? Don't take offence Pastors . I am sure most of you here start using the Bible in a short time while in the pulpit as a herald of the King of Kings . But if anyone here has visited a church has this happened ? I visited a church once and the preacher did not reference the Scripture for a whole 30 minutes . I left at that point . BTW , this was at a self-proclaimed "Fundamentalist Church " .
     
  2. Mexdeaf

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    Never have worried about it too much. Always considered 'socializing' to be a part of 'fellowshipping' and of 'worship'. Of course since I work with the deaf our services tend to be a little less formal than in hearing churches. We have a mix of folks from fairly well educated to those with almost no education so many times as I preach the Word other folks in the church are 'interpreting' for the less educated. Plus, aren't we ALWAYS in the presence of the Lord?

    Yeah, seen that happen a few times- usually one famous (or infamous as your point of view may be) and now dead guy who did it all the time. I start my messages with the Scripture reading (the text of the message) and usually have no less than 10 Scripture refs to back up the points in my messages.

    One other thing that always kind of bugs me is many times a pastor will reference a certain passage and then start to read it before folks can find it in their Bibles. Personally I believe that we should give folks a little time to find it or use PP so they can read it for themselves. Helps prevent those nasty little mis-applications and twisting of Scriptures.
     
  3. tinytim

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    Number 1: I love to hear the voices, laughter, babies crying, children playing at the beginning of the service. It is a sign that the church is not dead. It also shows that the people are getting along, and the fellowship amongst brothers and sisters is sweet. After all, we are in the home of our Father... Wouldn't home be a miserable place if we never talked, laughed, etc. I think God enjoys His children enjoying themselves.

    Number 2: I usually start with an opening illustration that is connected to the sermon points... This gets the people's attention (instead of talking and laughing with one another... lol... just kidding) The very next thing I do is give the Main text and read from it. I allow plenty of time for the people to turn to it as I give the background of the text in order to set it in context. Then I read it. I also use PowerPoint, and it is on the screen (The older people love it because of failing eyesight) Then all my other references (anywhere from 5 to 30... seriously.. one time I used 30 when I was starting out!!) are also on the PP. I never did like it when the preacher stalled getting into the Word.
     
  4. Rippon

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    Regarding #1 TT , I think a certain amount of reverence is called for prior to the worship service . Quietness is a good thing before we gather together collectively . Babies are babies and babies cry . But children should be taught by their parents that the corporate assembly of the saints is one of solemnity . However parents may be just as guilty as their untaught children . Laughter before the worship service is distasteful to me . What is the subject matter ? The latest secular news ? The latest sports event ? How about preparing hearts before the service ? Take time to be quiet , read the Bible , pray , settle-down . There is time for talking together after the service is over -- if then . The message -- if a convicting one should be on our minds . There is such a rush to have a confab .
     
  5. Mexdeaf

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    Personally, I have always believed that the 'heart preparation' should be done BEFORE going in to the service- at home.
     
  6. Rippon

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    I'm not negating the need for heart prearation at home before meeting with other believers to worship and praise the Lord . What I am saying is that some folks tend to make a lot of noise in the sanctuary till the very last moment . Laughter and loudness and all sorts of stuff is out of place when we are meeting together in joint worship of the King of Kings . And the same thing applies immediately after the worship service . Quietness is a good thing . "Be still and know that I am God " comes to mind . We can make joyful noise that is meant for the Lord during worship .
     
  7. Tom Bryant

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    We view the time before the service as a tme when family members can re-establishg contacts with each other. We want people talking to visitors, laughing.

    Heaven won't be a silent place. When it happens in the future it makes for its' own verse, Revelation 8:1. :tonofbricks:
     
  8. Amy.G

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    That's funny you say that because that's just what our pastor said yesterday after we had our greetings! After everyone is seated and the announcements are made, the pastor says "take a few minutes to love on each other". I love that! "Love on each other". Maybe you have to be southern to appreciate that saying. So for about 10 minutes or so that's what we do. Lot's of hugging and handshaking. Then we settle down and worship in an orderly manner. I think it's great!
    :1_grouphug: <--------our church!
     
  9. SBCPreacher

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    Number 1: I love fellowship! I love to hear our church family laughing together, up in the isles visiting. In fact, we make time in the service for the family to greet one another. This also helps our guests feel at home. Churches are alive - living things make noise. Cemeteries, OTOH, are real quiet.

    Number 2. Lots of scritpure. At the beginning and all the way through.
    I came across this the other day... "In an article titled, The Value of Expository Preaching and Teaching, Roger Johnson writes, 'All too often the biblical passage read to the congregation resembles the national anthem played at sporting events. It gets things started but it is not referred to again during the lesson. The authority behind preaching resides not in the preacher but in the biblical texts' (Stephen Olford, Preaching the Word of God, p.23-24)."
     
    #9 SBCPreacher, Mar 12, 2007
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  10. mcdirector

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    I'm never in the sanctuary at that time. I'm always still in the media center. Most weeks I barely get in church for a song. I love what I do though, so it's worth it most of the time.

    Pretty quick. I'm usually pulling my Bible out as soon as we sit down.
     
  11. tinytim

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    Rippon, what kind of church background do you have?

    It is funny that you would bring this up today...
    Yesterday, I, as the pastor, told our leadership right before service started that we were going to start 5 minutes late... the people were having a great time of fellowship, and because of the weather over the last few weeks, we have had to cancel a lot. Yesterday, most finally made it out.
    And they were "lovin on each other" a lot... it is a great sight when the people actually love each other.

    I believe the sound of His children getting along is a sweet sound to our Heavenly Father.

    As soon as I began giving the announcements though, you could have heard a pin drop. And they became very reverent.
    Christians don't have to have a frown on, or not be themselves to be holy.

    If I wasn't a pastor, just a church member, and I was visiting a church and all the people were just sitting there 10 minutes before service all quiet, and looking forward... I would leave. From my culture here in WV, that is just tooo weird.
     
  12. Brian30755

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    I think I understand where Rippon is coming from.....because I used to get really frustrated myself at the church I was attending a few years ago. Not that I'm against fellowshipping or laughing in church, I'm all for it. But, to so many people, going to church does seem to be just a social outing. There seemed to be a lack of reverence among most people at that church, and I guess I did let it get to me more than I should have. But the constant chit-chat and giggling extended into the service, not just before it.

    I really like what they do at the church I now attend. Service starts at 10:30. At 10:25, someone gets a microphone and asks everyone to, basically, stop the socializing and start preparing their hearts for worship. A lot of prayer and praise follow.....some folks praying and praising out loud, others silently. Some go to the altar and pray, some stay in their seats. Some stand, some sit. They put a PowerPoint thing (I guess that's what it is) on the screen that has a clock on it that counts down from 5 minutes, and it displays all the many names of Jesus this whole time it's counting down (By names I mean things like "Prince of Peace", "King of Kings", "Lord of Lords", "Master", "Savior", etc.) Plus, they are playing a recorded song during this 5 minutes that, to me, helps me prepare my heart for worship.

    As people arrive during this last 5 minutes before service starts, they see what is going on and they are usually very reverent as they take their seats.

    As soon as the 5 minute clock counts down to zero, the music begins and the choir starts singing.

    I kinda like it this way.
     
  13. Rippon

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    It looks as though Brian and I are the only members authoring the Minority Report for this topic (#1 ) .

    TT , I really don't think there is an equivalence between having " a frown on " and being reverent . I still think that most North American ( maybe other cultures as well ) just do not recognize the weaknesses that I have addressed . A.W. Tozer from an earlier generation had many perceptive things to say about just this kind of thing . His "hard medicine " would be difficult for many here to swallow . People need to quiet-down and still themselves before the Lord -- privately and then in a corporate manner . Too much worldly-mindedness has entered the church of today without any notice being taken . Discernment is very much needed .
     
  14. blackbird

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    #1----Yes!

    #2---Reference is made before your hat hits the ground!!!!!:thumbs: :thumbs:
     
  15. Disgruntled UK Baptist

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    I start with scripture straight away most of the time. When I don't, there might be a brief illustration first, that's it. 2-3 minutes maximum. I don't blame you for leaving, I would have done the same.

    D.
     
  16. tinytim

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    I would like to know where to get the clock slide like you describe.
    I would be willing to try this.
    Can you find out and PM me, or post it here?
     
  17. ccrobinson

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    The only church I've ever been in that was quiet before the service was when I was a kid and that church was about as dead as they come. When I see and hear people at our church talking before the service, I always think of the song, "It's a Wonderful World."

    "I see friends shaking hands.
    Saying, how do you do.
    What they're really saying is "I love you."

    Sappy, I suppose, but that's what I see in our church.

    The people don't get quiet until the choir starts singing the opening song. I'd rather have it that way than for everybody to be quiet. That way, when I'm playing the prelude, they won't hear my mistakes. :laugh:

    A few years ago, I was invited to play piano for a special service at our last church, where I was a member for over 10 years. They'd "called" (more like hired if you ask me) a new preacher and in his sermon, he didn't reference one single verse of Scripture. My wife and I were very surprised by that and were very happy that God led us to leave that church when we did.
     
  18. tinytim

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    #18 tinytim, Mar 14, 2007
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  19. SBCPreacher

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  20. tinytim

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    #20 tinytim, Mar 14, 2007
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