Sometimes we should check science out.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

How is our transformation an effect on truth in the natural world? Are you going Eastern on me here -- that everything is merely imagined and that we can alter reality by altering our own thoughts? That seems to be the direction that your transformation track will end up. Note that I'm not denying our need for personal transformation -- just that our own repentance and coming into a salvific relationship with God through Christ will change the world.

As for epistemology, there are levels of surety that can be gained in several ways, logic, physical testing and repetition of some form, or cross-examined testimony, for starters. We run the range from utter surety to utter un-surety, with points between of plausible, possible, potential, etc. Science is but one way of discovering knowledge, and we don't seek to remove that means. Why would we?

Some would, some would not... Just like here on the Baptist Board, some agree with me and some do not. We all come from a worldview position that largely informs our thought process. Can't lump all people -- in or out of science -- with one lump.

What war? Oh, the same war started by Satan in Genesis chapter 3? :wavey: Need to define the actual enemy and it is not science, nor is it "flesh and blood" (or so says the Word).

Not really... I'm actually waiting one day to hear Christ say, "Well done, good and faithful servant..."

Let's examine a few things just for fun. First, are you somehow teleporting this information to me and the board by some supernatural means, or are you, by chance, using the means that has been given us by the investigations of science to type with a keyboard and have your thoughts expressed via electronic transmission means (that would have appeared as magic in a former era!) across great distances and through material substances that otherwise hold no power of communication? Second, I'll bet you have electricity, clean running water, vaccinations, food that doesn't kill you, medical supplies and pills, and all sorts of other modern conveniences at your beck and call -- all derived after much scientific inquiry into the nature of God's creation. Need I go on? I can...

Talking about scientists who are Christian? Of course I've met some. There are many out there. You have to keep up or be left behind in the dark ages! Science is now seeing a radical shift to the things of God because many of their a priori worldview positions are being found as untenable. They have virtually exhausted the potential for an evolutionary cause to life on earth (hence the space program to find life on other planets -- which, BTW, only pushes the problem farther away, but does not reconcile the issues at hand), they have virtually exhausted the issues surrounding the start of the cosmos, and are now turning to metaphysics to describe what is (rather than what is not). This goes on in every realm. In the field of DNA, the founding father of the genome is a believer in Christ. In cosmology, many are turning to the God of the Bible after finding that the Bible is the only book that matches their observations of the universe. On and on it goes...

Even the world's foremost atheist philosopher (the first atheist philosopher to give a new argument since Hume!) moved away from his radical atheism to a position of Deism (Anthony Flew). No, as far as we know, he did not make a true profession of faith in Jesus Christ, but he did profess that there is a God and that that God matches the God of the Bible -- a HUGE admission for that man. You should read his book...

I've fallen for "nothing." In today's world, over 50% of science is not science at all, but philosophical exploration in the realm of metaphysics. They cannot test or repeat many of their larger cosmological arguments, nor can they test or repeat many of their macro-evolutionary arguments. But, those are realms of philosophy, not pure science, and we (yes, WE) need to become educated enough to deal with that level of information in their own fields in order to be a force for true truth in a world led by speculation and innuendo based in a priori worldview expectations.

At least I'm not blind and working at hiding my head in the sand (while using the scientific technology as if it is something set apart because we use it for God's glory).

Sometimes yes, sometimes no... You and I (and all the other people on this board) know that we argue back and forth about "truth" within the church every day around here. Just being the church is not a guarantee that we are THE repository for truth. We SHOULD be, but alas, we are not always.

Works both ways... So are "religious" churched men... Seems that we have a dilemma at hand, with "no one righteous, no not one..."

That the best you got? Come on, you can do better than that! :thumbs: