Sorrow to Repentance

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Brother Bob, Aug 24, 2007.

  1. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob
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    There was a time in my life that I realized that I was lost and was going to hell if I died in that condition. I became sorry for all the sins I had ever committed against God and sought repentance of which I finally received after some time. Actually I spent three years going to church, praying, crying a many of a tear, before I finally felt the hand of the Lord on me and a "feeling of relief" from the burden of my sins. I felt God had heard my cries and lifted me from the marr of the clay, unto a lively Hope in Jesus Christ, raised to walk a newness of life, "born again". I have been on this road for many years now, and have never found or desired to turn back. I am on my way to Heaven and Jesus is my personal Saviour, My Lord, My All in All.

    When you were seeking repentance, were you "sorrow" that you had sinned against God?


    2Cr 7:10For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
     
  2. npetreley

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    Can sorrow and repentance be separated? If I believe what I'm doing is right, then why should I feel sorry about it or repent? Conversely, if I TRUELY repent, then am I not showing that I'm sorry about what I was doing?

    To put it another way, how can I not be sorry I was doing something and still truly repent of it? If I feel what I was doing was justified, then what would be the point of repenting?
     
  3. Brother Bob

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    Very good answer Npet;
     
  4. convicted1

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    The bible says to REPENT, believe, and be baptized. Repentance is NECESSARY to SALVATION! If you never become sorry for the sinful life you live, you can't be saved. Apostle Paul spoke on more than one occassion about the sorrowfullness he had for persecuting the church. He said he did it through his own ignorance. So if you never become "sorry" for ALL the wrong you have done, you will die in your sins. Not pointing this towards anyone in particular, just thinking out loud. Love.

    Willis Fletcher, Jr.
     
  5. Amy.G

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    2Cr 7:9 I now rejoice, not that you were made sorrowful, but that you were made sorrowful to {the point of} repentance; for you were made sorrowful according to {the will of} God, so that you might not suffer loss in anything through us.
    2Cr 7:10 For the sorrow that is according to {the will} {of} God produces a repentance without regret, {leading} to salvation, but the sorrow of the world produces death.

    I don't understand the difficulty in understanding this passage.

    You won't repent if don't feel sorrow for sinning against God. In order to feel sorrow, you must accept the fact that you have sinned.

    Worldly sorrow is not the same as feeling sorrow for sinning against God, and is useless toward salvation.

    1. Godly sorrow

    2. Repentance (because of your sorrow)

    3. Salvation
     
  6. Brother Bob

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    I agree Amy;. Without sorrow, there would be not repentance...IMO
     
  7. Amy.G

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    Aside from that just being common sense, the Bible says so. That should be enough. :)
     
  8. DHK

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    It contradicts Bob's OP.
    The passage quoted in 2Cor.7:9ff has nothing to do with salvation. It was written to believers.
    The OP, was talking about salvation. Bob was relating his own salvation experience. He said that when he was saved he felt sorry for his sins. Where does the Bible say that one has to be sorry for their sins in order to be saved? It doesn't.

    Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
     
  9. Amy.G

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    I think you're oversimplifying it.

    To "believe" you must believe/accept that you are a sinner, that you have sinned against God. When you realize this, you will be sorry for sinning and now see the need and have the desire to change/turn from your sins and turn to God.

    This is what believing is.

    You can't ignore the scripture;

    Godly sorrow produces repentance.
     
  10. DHK

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    Amy, your the one ignoring Scripture.
    An unsaved person cannot have Godly sorrow. The 2Cor.7 passage was written to believers about sin that they had committed after they were saved. The Bible says nothing about being sorry for your sins in order to be saved. Repentance (with respect to salvation) does not involve being sorry for your sins. One does not repent of their sins in order to be saved.
     
  11. Amy.G

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    How do you explain this verse?

    2Cr 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
     
  12. DHK

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    Here is how Ray Steadman puts it:
    http://www.pbc.org/library/files/html/3689.html

    I think he says it well.
     
  13. Brother Bob

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    Here is what John Wesley had to say about 2 Corth 7:9

    http://gbgm-umc.org/umw/wesley/serm-027.stm

    Sermon 27 (text from the 1872 edition)
    Upon Our Lord's Sermon on The Mount, VII

    by John Wesley


    5. But let us take care to afflict our souls as well as our bodies. Let every season, either of public or private fasting, be a season of exercising all those holy affections which are implied in a broken and contrite heart. Let it be a season of devout mourning, of godly sorrow for sin; such a sorrow as that of the Corinthians, concerning which the Apostle saith, "I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance. For ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing. For godly sorrow" -- hE kata Theon lypE, -- the sorrow which is according to God, which is a precious gift of his Spirit, lifting the soul to God from whom it flows -- "worketh repentance to salvation, not to be repented of." Yea, and let our sorrowing after a godly sort work in us the same inward and outward repentance; the same entire change of heart, renewed after the image of God, in righteousness and true holiness; and the same change of life, till we are holy as He is holy, in all manner of conversation. Let it work in us the same carefulness to be found in him, without spot and blameless; the same clearing of ourselves, by our lives rather than words, by our abstaining from all appearance of evil; the same indignation, vehement abhorrence of every sin; the same fear of our own deceitful hearts; the same desire to be in all things conformed to the holy and acceptable will of God; the same zeal for whatever may be a means of his glory, and of our growth in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ; and the same revenge against Satan and all his works, against allfilthiness both of flesh and Spirit. (2 Cor. 7:9, &c.)
     
  14. Brother Bob

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    #14 Brother Bob, Aug 24, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 24, 2007
  15. Amy.G

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    DHK, you may be right, but IMO it seems as if Paul is speaking of eternal salvation because of the last part of the verse:

    2Cr 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

    It seems to me that Paul is comparing Godly sorrow-life

    to worldly sorrow-death

    I'm not saying that he wasn't speaking to Christians, but rather making a point about what true repentance is and that it comes from sorrow and leads to salvation. But just a general observation and not saying that those people weren't saved.
     
    #15 Amy.G, Aug 24, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 24, 2007
  16. DHK

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    1. I read Wesley quickly but as far as I can tell he didn't use the word "salvation" which was the question being asked.
    2. Wesley was not only the founder of the Methodists, but also of the holiness movement.
    3. From the holiness movement invariably sprang the tongues movement--a movement thinking that some "spiritual gift" like tongues would help make one more "holy."
    4. I don't see what Wesley has to say has much bearing on the subject.

    Again where does the Bible say that one has to be sorry for their sins in order to be saved? It doesn't.
     
  17. Brother Bob

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    You need to just read the part I posted of his sermon and see he said "salvation".

    Sometimes DHK; there is this thing called "common sense"!!!!
     
  18. Amy.G

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    I think what we're trying to say is that only when a person realizes their sinful state and that they have sinned against God will they even come to God. Anyone who is content in their sinful state and doesn't feel any sorrow isn't even going to seek God's forgiveness or acceptance.
    I think this is where the Holy Spirit draws us and reveals our sin so that we are even able to be sorry.
     
  19. DHK

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    Indeed he does. This passage has been read at many Christian funerals as a passage of comfort. We dont sorrow as the world sorrows. Our sorrow is a Godly sorrow. Compared to the world's sorrow; they who have nothing to look forward to except death itself.

    Their sorrow wrought a change in their lives, but it was a change for service for the Lord, not a change for salvation:

    2 Corinthians 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
     
  20. DHK

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    But repentance isn't sorrow and sorrow doesn't save.
     

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