Featured Specific threats to Christians about losing eternal life!

I would expect that theology from your salvation by works. Your faith must be small or nonexistent. You gave a long list of nonsense. Why your presence here is tolerated I cannot figure out. This is a distinctive in the Baptist and Presbyterian faiths. Why are you here?

Go to a Church of Christ board so you can add baptism to your list of things necessary for salvation. Honestly, at times I think the RCC has a better grasp of the Gospel than you clowns.

Yes you can refer to that as DD, and I will refer to you as DA.

 

Therefore, to you who believe, He is precious; but to those who are disobedient, " The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief cornerstone," and "A stone of stumbling and a rock of offense." They stumble, being disobedient to the word, to which they also were appointed. But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.

 

I myself have wondered about that.

 

I think that in the case of your posts - that is a given.

 

You give another perfect example of a misapplication/conclusion of a parable due to the lack of knowledge concerning born-again. I will reiterate;

A failure to incorporate the most vital detail Jesus taught into one's study of any passage of scripture will ultimately cause an error in the doctrine one decides to hold and defend concerning salvation. And that is "ye must be born-again". If regeneration is not understood, nor considered, then passages such as the four soils will be misconstrued in many ways.

Do an in depth study of born-again, born of God, regeneration. Find every passage that deals with this miracle performed by God, then take that information and study the rest of these so called warnings against losing salvation. Suddenly, a different light will become apparently clear.

Build your doctrine beginning with solid, clear passages, not parables. Begin with scripture that actually uses the words "born-again", "regeneration", "born of God", "born of the Spirit", and continue on from there. Understand just what this entails, then those parables and "warnings" will become so much clearer.

We are instructed to "Study, ....rightly divide the word of Truth" (2Tim2). We are instructed to build doctrine carefully (1Cor3) , not just grab from here and there without first doing the proper foundation laying.

 

How about just accept the fact that those saved by jesus have etrnal life, shall NEVER die again, as he stated, and WILL be raised and glorified when he returns?

Ultimate words are what Jesus said, not what your prophetess has said!

 

Well, I am a Christian, who happens to be a baptist!

Good question though as to why we allow SDA and Charasmatic Chaos here, as this is under other denominations, but thought was suppossed to be other Chrsitian ones?

 

he may very well be, but His church is not!

he would be same as a Catholic, in that individuals are saved in both SDA/RCC, but both churches NOT Christian, each has a different Gospel!

 

Indeed but I have to go to name-callers-r-us to find out.

Hard to get this from anywhere else! :thumbsup:

 

Jesus said "he who believes" not "he who falls from Grace".

And in Romans 11 Paul gives a lot of clarity to that point.

Pretty hard to Bible readers to miss -- name-callers maybe- - but I don't think Bible readers will miss it.

in Christ,

Bob

 

A page or two of carping and name-calling recently -- so I am going to post some actual Bible texts - who knows - someone may want to take a break from just name-calling and read some scripture.

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"Instead" of "All that become saved will stay saved" Jesus teaches in Matt 13 that there are 4 different kinds of ground - 3 of which become saved but only 1 "stays saved".

Instead of Jesus teaching that all that become saved by accepting the Gospel - will always choose to stay saved - Jesus points us to the example of "Forgiveness revoked" in Matt 18.

Instead of God teaching that all that become saved by accepting the Gospel - will always choose to stay saved - God points us to the example of the righteous that turn from their walk with God - (God who alone can produce righteousness in the saints) - and when they turn from God all their righteousness is as nothing in Ezek 18.

Notice that in that chapter is it the real saved that are becoming lost for failure to persevere in that saved walk - and it is the real lost that are becoming saved when they turn from their rebellion.

Ezek 18
19 “Yet you say, ‘Why should the son not bear the guilt of the father?’ Because the son has done what is lawful and right, and has kept all My statutes and observed them, he shall surely live.

20 The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.
21 “But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all My statutes, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die.

22 None of the transgressions which he has committed shall be remembered against him; because of the righteousness which he has done, he shall live.
23 Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?” says the Lord God, “and not that he should turn from his ways and live?
24 “But when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness and commits iniquity, and does according to all the abominations that the wicked man does, shall he live? All the righteousness which he has done shall not be remembered; because of the unfaithfulness of which he is guilty and the sin which he has committed, because of them he shall die.
25 “Yet you say, ‘The way of the Lord is not fair.’ Hear now, O house of Israel, is it not My way which is fair, and your ways which are not fair? 26 When a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity, and dies in it, it is because of the iniquity which he has done that he dies.

27 Again, when a wicked man turns away from the wickedness which he committed, and does what is lawful and right, he preserves himself alive. 28 Because he considers and turns away from all the transgressions which he committed, he shall surely live; he shall not die.

29 Yet the house of Israel says, ‘The way of the Lord is not fair.’ O house of Israel, is it not My ways which are fair, and your ways which are not fair?


In the examples above God is not arbitrarily casting any out - rather the individuals themselves are turning away from God. "Fallen from Grace - severed FROM Christ" Gal 5:4


And of course let's not avoid Christ's teaching in Romans 11




Rom 11
20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.

21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either.

22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off


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"Forgiveness revoked" model as Matt 18

Matt 18
32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
35 So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.




It works on the same model as Romans 11


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Romans 11


18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.
19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.
20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.


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Our Methodist/Wesleyan/Seventh-day Adventist/Arminian General Baptist (and of course - Free Will Baptist) friends will notice that the language above is missing the "legally obligated to take those who do not persevere firm to the end" to heaven language.

Just as we see in Ezek 18 - no change.

The whosoever will factor is there - as well as the warning against being the rock-ground that sprin[SIZE=3]gs up "to LIFE" and [SIZE=3]rec[SIZE=3]e[SIZE=3]ives the Word of [SIZE=3]Life quick[SIZE=3]ly and with [SIZE=3]joy - but then [SIZE=3]later falls aw[SIZE=3]ay - dying - returning to the dead state Matt 1[SIZE=3]3.[/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE]

 

CANNOT apply Old Covenant promises to us under the New One, as their was conditional, ours is unconditional!

WHAT name calling?
Cannot be addressing the false prophetess or false doctrines held by the SDA, are they?

 

Your intepretation is not contextually based. Only one kind of ground is called "good" and the ground is the condition of the heart. None of the types of ground (hearts) are called "good" - NONE! Only one kind of ground produces a crop. Notice this kind of "good" ground (heart) is the only ground that characterizes various saved people. The other three are various types of false professors.

 

As I stated, you may very well be a christian, but the SDA is a cult!

 

And there ladies and gentlemen is that claim to "Two Gospels" we keep reading about in Gal 1:6-11. Paul claims there is no such thing - and yet we still have people today claim 1 gospel for 4000 years and then another one for 2000 years.

But oddly enough - that post above is in response to Romans 11, Matt 18, Gal 5:4 -- you know - the "Fallen from Grace" texts of the New Testament.

Oh well.

in Christ,

Bob

 

Matt 6:15 • God forgives His faithful children as they forgive others.
Matt 13:3-8,18-23 • Christ gives 2 examples of coming to life and then dying - returning to the lost state and 1 example of persevering
Matt 18:21-35 • Christ teaches unforgiveness of others will result in our own forgiveness by God - being revoked.
Rom 11:20-22 • By faith, continue in God’s goodness and fear ... otherwise you will be cut off. God is able to renew again those who have fallen if they do not continue in unbelief.
Gal 5:1-4 • There is such a thing as fallen from grace and separated from Christ after becoming a Christian.

In Ezek 18 - all the righteous live and all the wicked die. No king at the time of Ezekiel made the claim that they were able to kill every person that is wicked. In fact the complaint in Ezekiel is that the wicked are not being held accountable and the nation is therefore under God's judgment. In the chapter there is no law of the land that is said to be violated on that a person turned to sin before God instead of obeying God.

Ezek 18:4 says "The soul that sins - it shall die". According to Matt 10:28 that can only happen in the second death.

Thus the same "forgiveness revoked" lesson that you see in Matt 18 - is seen again in Ezek 18.

in Christ,

Bob

 

Thank you for stating your personal opinion.

Walter Martin stated his - and put it in a book - confirming that the doctrines of the SDA church are indeed main stream Christianity and are included as in-house discussion within the body of Christ.

But I have repeatedly affirmed the free will system described in the Bible provided by God - and you have the free will to choose that personal opinion.

in Christ,

Bob