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"Spiritual Israel" or "Spiritual Jew"

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by beameup, Jan 7, 2012.

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  1. beameup

    beameup Member

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    I've been looking through my online Bible and can't seem to locate these in the text.
     
    #1 beameup, Jan 7, 2012
  2. asterisktom

    asterisktom Well-Known Member
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    You might start with Romans 2:28-29.
     
    #2 asterisktom, Jan 7, 2012
  3. beameup

    beameup Member

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    I'd like something from the O.T. or the Gospels... especially the Gospels, since Jesus was God in the flesh.
     
    #3 beameup, Jan 7, 2012
  4. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    yes...it is right next to your second circle...you know

    The saved-carnal-self directed- it's right there!
     
    #4 Iconoclast, Jan 8, 2012
  5. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    Sometimes one simply has to accept what God has given. :smilewinkgrin:
     
    #5 Aaron, Jan 8, 2012
  6. beameup

    beameup Member

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    You mean to accept a belief/doctrine just "by faith" [Sola fide]?


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    And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual,
    but as unto ego-centric, even as unto babies in Christ.     - 1Cor 3:1
     
    #6 beameup, Jan 8, 2012
  7. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    No. If God used synechdoche to allude to spiritual Israel through Paul (Gal. 4:22-31) instead of the verbatim you demand through Jesus or Moses, then that's good enough.
     
    #7 Aaron, Jan 8, 2012
  8. beameup

    beameup Member

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    So when this same Paul devotes an entire chapter
    in easy-to-understand language and states that
    true Israel has not been "cast off" and will be
    grafted back in and saved are we supposed
    to take that as the "verbatim" or "synechdoche"?

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    And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual,
    but as unto ego-centric, even as unto babies in Christ.     - 1Cor 3:1
     
    #8 beameup, Jan 8, 2012
  9. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    You certainly didn't repeat it verbatim. He said God is able to graft the "natural branches" back in, not "true Israel."

    And Paul is employing a metaphor.

    Verbatim means exact words. Syncechdoche and metonymy are the mention of part of something in reference the whole. When Paul spoke of "the Jerusalem that is above," He means the Israel that is above, or spiritual Israel.

    So, though you cannot find the exact words "spiritual Israel," spiritual israel is an entity dealt with at length in the Scriptures. Rabbi's speak of "eternal Israel," meaning the same thing.
     
    #9 Aaron, Jan 8, 2012
  10. beameup

    beameup Member

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    I'm sure if you reread my post you will note that I didn't quote anything "verbatim". I simply "characterized" the contents of Romans 11
    which appears to be clear and concise language and not a "metaphor".

    I note that you haven't produced one single passage from the Gospels or the O.T. to support my original question.

    Paul introduces the subject of the chapter:
    Rom 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
    - sounds like Paul is stating that he is a genetic Jew to me.

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    And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual,
    but as unto self-serving, even as unto babies in Christ.     1 Cor 3:1
     
    #10 beameup, Jan 8, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 8, 2012
  11. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Exactly Aaron....

     
    #11 Iconoclast, Jan 8, 2012
  12. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I suppose because all the apostles were Jews, they would count as "spiritual Jews."

    Also, because 120,000 Jews will be saved during the great tribulation, they might be considered the "spiritual Israel."

    Some think the church is the holder of the promises as "spiritual Israel."
    I don't.
     
    #12 agedman, Jan 8, 2012
  13. DaChaser1

    DaChaser1 New Member

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    Spiritual isreal is NOT the NT Church...

    it IS those messianic jews who have received Jesus as the Jewish messiah, and they would be 'completed jews"...


    So in the Church would be today 'spritual" Jews who received jesus, and gentiles who were "grafted in"...

    per Apostle paul, this did NOT mean Isreal replaced by or is now known as the Church, and that national isreal, jewish peoples in the Flesh still have a future plan with God!
     
    #13 DaChaser1, Jan 10, 2012
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