Sr. Pastor in charge?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by webdog, Jan 16, 2008.

  1. webdog

    webdog
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    On a now closed thread, this statement was made
    I'm failing to understand where the Sr. Pastor has the authority to make the other pastors wear what he wants them to wear.

    Where is it found scripturally that the Sr. Pastor (elder) has authority over the other elders?
     
    #1 webdog, Jan 16, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 16, 2008
  2. pinoybaptist

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    With you on this one, webdog, all the way.
    Reminds me of the church in Maryland where the congregation is asked to stand and clap their hands as the Pastor comes in.
    My wife and I headed for the door real quick.
     
  3. annsni

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    It depends on the "in charge" meaning you mean. Our senior pastor is in charge of the church staff and the other pastors in day to day runnings. He has a pastoral staff of 10 other pastors who he consults with and such but he has the final say in certain areas. Of course he's not the sole dictator of all that happens in church. We also have a deacon board who also have areas of responsibility. But the senior pastor can ask any of the other pastors and employees to do something such as dress nicely or wear a suit in the Sunday service and they have every right to say "no". But then he also has every right to fire them. :laugh:
     
  4. Jkdbuck76

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    I don't have a problem with the senior pastor asking the other pastors to wear coat and tie......much in the same way I have no problem with a Principal asking his teachers/staff to do the same.

    Nothing wrong with a professional appearance. That is, unless you're at the kind of church that doesn't do that kind of thing.....like a surfer church or something like that.
     
  5. StefanM

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    This is where I see problems. IMO, the Sr. Pastor doesn't have the right to fire ordained ministers called by the church. I think that the local congregation is the only entity with the authority to remove an elder.

    Other staff, however, such as secretaries and janitorial employees, are another matter.
     
  6. annsni

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    All of our pastors are hired from within. We actually have 2 new men who just came on as pastoral interns with the intention of being ordained in the next few years - one just about finished with his schooling from Moody and the other one just beginning his education/training. So none have been "called by the church" and hired from the outside. The decision was made amongst the pastoral staff and I'm not sure if the deacons are even involved in that decision although if there were an issue, I'm sure they could meet with the senior pastor and discuss it with him. Honestly, no pastor has been fired at our church in the 40 years our senior pastor has been there, although we have sent out numerous pastors to the ministry in other churches or the missions. I do not see a "dress code suggestion" as being something that there would ever be a firing situation over. Pastor has never been unreasonable and he has reasons for what he asks - and all of those who work for him respect him enough to comply with something like that if he asks.

    Now, employees are a different story and I know that there have had to be a few people in the past who have had to be laid off unfortunately. But pastors? Nah.
     
  7. righteousdude2

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    A Radical Speaks UP!!!

    I would not remain in a church that had a dress code....it is not in the Scripture, like you say, and it sure isn't in my personal way of ministering. I like casual, and if that didn't feel right for the Sr. Guy, I would find another place to serve the Lord.
     
  8. StefanM

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    Does the church even vote to install these men?
     
  9. The Archangel

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    Where in Maryland, if I might ask?

    The Archangel
     
  10. annsni

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    No - the church doesn't vote them in. Thinking about it now, I do remember that the deacons voted for my husband to come in so it's not just the pastoral staff who makes that decision. It's between the pastors and deacons. The congregation itself doesn't vote in the new pastors (we only have one congregational vote each year and that's for the budget).
     
  11. StefanM

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    Wow. No wonder I couldn't understand what was going on. It doesn't sound traditionally "Baptist" in terms of congregational governance.
     
  12. Aaron

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    A pastor holds the office of bishop. A bishop is an overseer with the authority to see that what is done is done properly, decently and in order. Whether or not each bishop in a church has equal authority is a determination of the local congregation, however, even in cases where there is equal authority, the Apostle's admonition (which is especially to the elders) is that "ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment." (1 Cor. 1:10) If one is going to kick against the request that one wear a manner of dress befitting of his calling, I would wonder about his qualifications to serve as a pastor.
     
  13. KJVkid

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    I'm failing to understand where the Sr. Pastor has the authority to make the other pastors wear what he wants them to wear.

    Where is it found scripturally that the Sr. Pastor (elder) has authority over the other e


    Are you serious, you don't know or are you just trying to get something started?
    Try something easy like, Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that [is] unprofitable for you.
     
  14. Joshua Rhodes

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    Congregational polity is another thread, but I wish our church was like this sometimes. We have business meetings out the wazoo...
     
  15. StefanM

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    Note the plural. IMO, the pastors of the church are all elders. What gives one elder the right to unilaterally determine policy for the other elders?
     
  16. mcdirector

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    The church gives him the authority to determine that policy in the way they set up the job positions.
     
  17. StefanM

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    I'm speaking scripturally. Is such an arrangement scriptural?
     
  18. mcdirector

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    What about the Scripture that speaks to good order. We have over a dozen pastors on staff. They can't all have equal status on all issues. They are human. I do have an instance in mind and it didn't play out well.
     
  19. StefanM

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    The same argument can be (and is) used to completely undermine congregational polity.

    I do believe that the pastors can be given areas of responsibility, but to place one elder in a position over the others to the extent that he has the power to unilaterally dismiss another elder is closer to episcopal church polity than baptist polity.
     
  20. mcdirector

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    I do think things get tricky in a very large church with many pastors and it's been years (since I was a teen) that I've been a member of a church less than at least 5000 members.

    At my current church, we do have pastors come and go and move into new positions without our (the general congregations) knowledge which I'm not happy with - although I am sure the deacons have been consulted (or just told). AND I'm volunteer staff (with the media center) and staff (with the day school) so I'm more in the know than the general congregation and things still surprise me. We've been here going on 15 years. My rememberance of how things were done at past churches is fading.

    Scripture aside, I think churches have gone toward the trend of running like a business with the senior pastor operating as a President/CEO of a company and the financial person operating as a CFO. Again, the only scripture I can think of to support this are the ones indicating that things should be done orderly. mmmmm Well there are the ones about Chief Priest too . . .
     

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