Stalemate dims prospects for $25B auto bailout

Discussion in 'News / Current Events' started by carpro, Nov 17, 2008.

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  1. carpro

    carpro
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    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081117/ap_on_go_co/congress_returns

    Stalemate dims prospects for $25B auto bailout

    AP – Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nev., center, stands newly-elected Senators on Capitol Hill in Washington, … WASHINGTON –

    Prospects dimmed Monday for enactment of a $25 billion bailout for the faltering auto industry before year's end, as congressional Democrats and the Bush administration seemed headed for a stalemate. Help for Detroit's Big Three, which have been battered by the economic meltdown that has choked their sales and frozen their credit, is falling victim to a partisan fight over where the money should come from.
     
  2. Bro. Curtis

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    We have a thriving auto manufacturing industry in the southern states. I say Jennifer Granholm helped create the Michigan mess, and now she's holding her hand out, as well.

    Did you see her on stage with Obama's "financial experts" a week ago ?

    What a joke.
     
  3. carpro

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    It seems like everyone in Michigan has their hand out.

    It would be throwing good money after bad.

    Let 'em fish or cut bait without wasting our $25 billion to delay the inevitable.
     
  4. sag38

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    Help them out only if they agree to get rid of the corrupt union influence that demands unrealistic wages, etc.
     
  5. dragonfly

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    We need to insure that the United States has a healthy automobile industry. If this requires a bailout then so be it. The republicans may block it now, but after January 20th, I believe it will take place.
     
  6. windcatcher

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    I disagree that a bailout will make the auto industry healthy:
    Foreign companies are building autos here in the US and making a healthy profit and cars with economy and reliability.

    The US auto makers are stifled by union contracts and obligations which were based upon false economic predictions and greed, and an unrealistic belief that what they were offering to the American people was what the people wanted in a changeing economy..... Well they didn't adapt any faster than a slug. Time for some salt!

    If the auto makers are allowed to go bankrupt and file chapter 11..... what's the worse that can happen? Out dated and unrealistic contracts will be dumped. The fat in their pork barrels will have to be rendered out for leaner meat and more substance from labor balance with the competition of quality which consumers demand. Their progress under such circumstances of reorganization is likely to bring them back healthier and stronger than trying to salvage a failed system.

    Besides, when an executive from a major auto maker is willing to pay his corporate private jet $20,000 to fly him to Washington, DC to ask the Congress for our hard earned tax dollars to bail them out, when a airbus could make the same trip first class for $1,700.....round trip....... He hasn't a clue regarding the stewardship of public funds. A chapter 11 reorganization will save the auto industry. The bottomless pit of public dollars can not save from wasteful habits which haven't changed.

    Besides, was it not so long ago where some public monies were offered the auto industry to bridge the gap for more fuel efficient and alternative designs ....... and was it used wisely ..........NO! Let them reorganize and let labor and industry get back into the capitalist system of competition which made us both profitable and efficient in the past!
     
  7. windcatcher

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    Well God bless your sweet heart!
    This is so dumb to see it as a party issue!

    It is a taxpayer issue! It is an economic issue!

    It should not be a partisan issue!

    But there are those who particularly will say it is a party issue, and that the Democratic Party "owes'" them..... cause the unions contributed, they got out the vote, they transported the voters to the polls, they encouraged individual donations, the corporation lobbied and lined the coffins of candidates which were running and promised support....... well........hogwash...... The democrat citizens are as much taxpayers as independant and republican citizens are..... and these people in the Congress owe no business a bailout with our tax dollars!
     
  8. Revmitchell

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    Yep this is all about the Unions
     
  9. Mexdeaf

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    As much as I love cars, it's time for the manufacturers to get their houses in order or shut the doors- without government help.
     
  10. webdog

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    Someone on local radio had a better plan. Take the money the gov't wants to give the auto industries, divide it up amongst every american 18 and older who pays taxes, and each would receive 422,000. That would be enough money to pay off our homes and buy...brand new cars from the big 3!
    Mortgage crisis and auto industry crisis gone, not to mention there would be no recession!
     
  11. rbell

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    Before agreeing to this, how 'bout reading THIS from Mitt Romney.

    He's got some personal expertise in the area. He says it would be a terrible idea, and I concur.

    The reason the Big 3 are sinking is because they make inferior products, with an inferior business model. Why does everyone want an Accord or Camry? Because they're better cars. Why? About $2,000 less in union embedded costs, less bloated management, more efficient, and more reliable.

    Why should I bail out a business that is flawed? And as my senator said, "Who's gonna bail out the American Taxpayer?"

    Amen!
     
  12. abcgrad94

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    Amen. Since when did our tax money become a bail out bank for irresponsible private companies?
     
  13. dragonfly

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    I like American built automobiles. I drive a Ford truck, myself. I don't know if a bailout will help the auto industry. Windcatcher assumed I supported it, but be careful when you assume. I only think we need a strong American automobile industry. If this can be done without a bailout and without hurting the American workers, so be it. If a bailout is needed, I support it. My point was that after President Obama takes office, and the new Democratic Congress is in session, a bailout is possible, if needed.
     
  14. rbell

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    If you (or anyone) went into a bank and said, "I need a loan for $25,000. I'm starting a business." The bank, very early in the process, would want to see your business plan. If you didn't have one, you'd be rushed out the door.

    These guys from the "Big 3" are clueless how they got where they did. They've offered no plan to get out of their funk. And they're slaves to the auto union, which is a primary cause of the mess they're in.

    No way they should get a dime.
     
  15. Bro. Curtis

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    Didja hear the executives all took private jets to D.C. to ask for this handout ?

    It's on CNN this morning.

    rbell nailed it, this is a union caused problem, and the union should be the one to bail them out.

    Not one dime to them, says I.
     
  16. Mexdeaf

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    Sounds like a Nigerian scam letter to me- take a look at Snopes: (maybe not the exact same thing as above, but close)

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/taxes/dividend.asp
     
  17. dragonfly

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    I bet you they get the money needed to stay afloat, pending a restructure of their practices. Now that the Democrats are taking over, things will be better for all. Only someone who is simple-minded would think it is a good thing to allow our auto industry to fail. Just imagine if we found ourselves in a war that was actually needed. Who would build our tanks and other military vehicles?
     
  18. swaimj

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    They need to declare bunkruptcy and restructure themselves into companies that can turn a profit. Right now they have too many brands, too many factories, too many workers, and too many dealerships. This is what Mitt Romney is advocating and I think it makes sense.
     
  19. rbell

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    So, Dragonfly...where in the Constitution does it become government's job to let some businesses fail, and others succeed?

    Stagecoach companies...we let them fail, and yet we've managed.

    Furthermore: when you give a company who is failing because of their poor decisions free money, what lesson is learned? What stops them from coming back next year for $100 billion?

    Thanks for the juvenile insult. I'm not "simple minded" for "letting a business fail." I just happen to believe enough in personal responsibility and the consequences of poor decisions to know that government can't rescue everyone and make everyone happy, wealthy, and carefree.

    Also, keep in mind: If the big 3 (whose execs flew down to DC in executive private jets (!), underscoring they don't get it) don't get their fix, they won't go out tomorrow. They'll restructure. Happens all the time. And if they do it right, they'll be like Harley Davidson--a thriving, profitable venture. If they let the unions run them in the ground, they'll be like Eastern Airlines...out.
     
  20. rbell

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    One more thing: Why should government rescue a company that builds inferior products? Case in point: What would you rather own...
    • A Ford Focus, or a Toyota Prius?
    • A Chevy Aveo, or a Nissan Versa?
    • A Dodge Caliber, or a Honda Civic?
    Kind of makes a strong point, eh?
     
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