Statue to honor Billy Graham

Discussion in '2006 Archive' started by standingfirminChrist, May 8, 2006.

  1. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist
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    (April 30, 2006)--At age 87, the Reverend Billy Graham can no longer stride to the pulpit and must use a walker to get around.

    But a bronze statue to be unveiled by the Southern Baptist Convention will recall the evangelist in his prime.

    Sculpted by the Reverend Terrell O'Brien of Wyoming, the figure of Graham will stand larger than life with a Bible in one hand and arms outstretched before a giant cross.

    The statue will be presented in June at the Southern Baptists' annual meeting in Greensboro, North Carolina, before being permanently installed at the denomination's headquarters in
    Nashville.

    Billy Graham

    In light of the scripture, one of the ten commandments,

    Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

    should we erect a statue of Billy Graham? Is not this breaking God's command not to do such?

    I know we have statues of presidents and pioneers and such, but that still does not give us the right to put up another statue; especially of one as well known as Mr Graham. IMO
     
  2. rbell

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    The context of Ex. 20:4 is about not having other gods before God, not so much about building a statue.

    The question is purpose. If we're planning on worshiping the stature, no doubt it's wrong. If we're building it to honor his years of service, I can't see that as idolatry.

    Having said that, I'm not a big fan of stuff like that. I can think of better uses for that money.

    Unwise? In my opinion, yep. Sinful/idolatrous? Nah.
     
  3. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist
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    I beg to differ.

    The fourth verse says don't make graven images. The fifth verse says don't bow down to them. But if one obeys the fourth verse, then one certainly will not have to worry about disobeying the fifth verse.

    Besides, many already venerate Mr. Graham as if he were the American Pope. Especially in the Southern Baptist Faith.
     
  4. rbell

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    So any sculpture is sin? Your interpretation would take it there. Sorry...I still think you're removing the verse from its contextual framework.

    I don't know of too many SBC folks that "venerate" Rev. Graham, though I'm sure there's some whose respect for him can cloud their judgement...after all, he's a sinner just like us. Anyone who has served God for the amount of time he has, and strived as hard as Graham does to maintain his ethics, and the number of folks that have heard the gospel because of him...sure; I think he has served as a fine example to many.

    However, I HAVE seen a few folks on this board go over the top in their criticism of him, bordering on slander.
     
  5. standingfirminChrist

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    The fourth verse does speak of idols when it speaks of graven image. the hebrew word for graven image does in fact mean, idol.

    But the verse goes on and says 'or any likeness.' Or any likeness goes outside of the idol thing.

    Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make <`asah> unto thee any graven image <pecel>, or any likeness <[email protected]> of any thing that <'aher> is in heaven <shamayim> above <ma`al>, or that is in the earth <'erets> beneath, or that is in the water <mayim> under the earth <'erets>:

    The verse would be translated to say, You may not make any idol for yourself, or any image of any thing in heaven, in earth, or the in the sea.

    By erecting a statue, one is in fact disobeying that verse whether one is setting that statue up for idol purposes or not.
     
  6. rbell

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    wow...that's almost muslim in it's approach.

    Sculpture is sin. Gee.

    Guess I'll go home and destroy my son's play-dough.
     
  7. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist
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    not muslim at all. It is the Word of God.
     
  8. rbell

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    SFIC...Let me back up. I'm not accusing you of being muslim, sympathizing, etc. I was saying that "all sculpture is evil" is a Muslim tenet. You seem to believe that, but for OBVIOUSLY different reasons (no doubt you follow the true God, not Allah). Sorry for the insinuation, that's not what I meant.

    But, I still strongly disagree with you, and think you're taking this verse out of context and taking this further than the text does.
     
  9. Joseph_Botwinick

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    So is prayer, giving alms, fasting, monotheism, etc...

    The comparison is not a good one. It actually seems somewhat inflammatory to me to make the comparison. ONe might be led to believe that you were trying to hang the extremist label around his neck by making the comparison.

    I don't know if I agree with SFIC on this all the way, but if you search hard enough, you will find common ground between Christians and almost every other sect in the world on some issues.


    Joseph Botwinick
     
  10. Daisy

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    Yeah, they're related. Much of the Koran is based on the Bible.

    I disagree, because it is true and they both come from the same tradition.

    But it is extreme to maintain that all sculptural representation of man and nature are sinful idolitry. The question then becomes if extremism is correct or not. Presumably, SFIC believes it is.

    Then they can be compared based on their similarities and differences. However, the Abrahamic religions are closer to each other than they are to most other religions in the world.

    Also, there is a difference between "comparison" and "equation".
     
  11. rsr

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    The commandment to avoid graven images must be understood as prohibiting the creation of idols.

    Otherwise the Bible would contradict itself.
     
  12. ktn4eg

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    If the commandment to not make any graven images was intended to mean of anything, anywhere, for any purpose whatsoever, then why did He command Moses to make cherubim to be placed on the Ark of the Covenant (Ex. 25:18)?
     
  13. Alcott

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    This goes along with a thesis I have promulgated on this board and in other settings-- the 8 1/2 commandments. The 'Ten Commandments' are repeated in the NT as obligatory to Christians except for the sabbath day and that part of the '2nd' commandment to (1st part)not make images or "any likeness of anything in heaven or earth." the 2nd part, to not worship them, is certainly repeated. If a statue itself is opposed to the commandments of God, then so is photography, engineering drawing, computer icons, and much more.

    I don't personally approve of the expense or the display of a statue to Graham, but I don't think it violates that (OT) commandment, or else innumerable things common to us violate it.
     
  14. pinoybaptist

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    Like the Bible says of those who are honored by men besides the very earthly and non-spiritual reasons, such as patriotism, bravery, political accomplishments, etc., 'they have their reward'.
     
  15. Terry_Herrington

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    This is hilarious, especially since the poster portrays an image of a tiger directly above the image of himself. [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    SFIC, do you even think about what you say the Bible says or do you just spout off the first thing that comes to mind?
     
  16. Magnetic Poles

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    And what about all these Ten Commandment monuments? Are they not graven images, even as they condemn the same?
     
  17. carpro

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    :confused:

    Doesn't sound much different from placing a picture and plaque in a church vestibule recognizing a beloved former pastor.
     
  18. Friend of God

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    I hope the statue has two faces on it.
    Then it will be a true likeness of someone who speaks out of both sides of his mouth to please whatever audience he is speaking to.
     
  19. carpro

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    Can you clarify your remark, please?
     
  20. Alcott

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    Are the Commandments self-defeating from the beginning of their proclamation, since they were engraved on stone and kept in a box that was venerated?
     

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