Steven J. Lawson, The Gospel Focus of Charles Spurgeon , Part I

Discussion in 'Calvinism/Arminianism Debate' started by Reformed, Dec 26, 2014.

  1. Reformed

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    Steven J. Lawson puts in proper context The Reformed doctrine of predestination and the evangelical call of the gospel.

    continued...
     
  2. Reformed

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    Steven J. Lawson, The Gospel Focus of Charles Spurgeon , Part II

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  3. BobRyan

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    How does Spurgeon's view of Calvinism show up in his "Baptist Confession of Faith" document?
     
  4. Reformed

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    Steven J. Lawson, The Gospel Focus of Charles Spurgeon , Part III

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    Steven J. Lawson, The Gospel Focus of Charles Spurgeon , Part IV

    continued.....

    continued...
     
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    Steven J. Lawson, The Gospel Focus of Charles Spurgeon , Part V

    continued.....

     
  7. Squire Robertsson

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  8. Reformed

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  9. Reformed

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    Spurgeon was unique in that he did not let his theological distinctives impede his gospel ministry mandate. What Spurgeon understood, and what Lawson brings out in his book, is that God ordains the means of His calling sinners to repentance and faith. How shall they hear without a preacher (Rom. 10:14)?
     
  10. Squire Robertsson

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    I know what you mean. I watched it first in ten-fifteen minute segments.
     
    #10 Squire Robertsson, Dec 26, 2014
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  11. Reformed

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    A better question is "where does it show up?" for it surely does. Here is a portion of Spurgeon's 1855 revision of the 1689 Second London Baptist Confession of Faith (underlining mine):


    10. Effectual Calling

    1. Those whom God has predestinated to life, He is pleased in His appointed and accepted time to effectually call by His Word and Spirit, out of that state of sin and death which they are in by nature, to grace and salvation by Jesus Christ. He enlightens their minds spiritually and savingly to understand the things of God. He takes away their heart of stone and gives to them a heart of flesh. He renews their wills, and by His almighty power, causes them to desire and pursue that which is good. He effectually draws them to Jesus Christ, yet in such a way that they come absolutely freely, being made willing by His grace.

    2. This effectual call is of God's free and special grace alone, not on account of anything at all foreseen in man. It is not made because of any power or agency in the creature who is wholly passive in the matter. Man is dead in sins and trespasses until quickened and renewed by the Holy Spirit. By this he is enabled to answer the call, and to embrace the grace offered and conveyed by it. This enabling power is no less power than that which raised up Christ from the dead.

    3. Infants dying in infancy are regenerated and saved by Christ through the Spirit, Who works when, where, and how He pleases. So also are all elect persons who are incapable of being outwardly called by the ministry of the Word.

    4. Others are not elected, although they may be called by the ministry of the Word, and may experience some common operations of the Spirit, yet because they are not effectually drawn by the Father, they will not and cannot truly come to Christ and therefore cannot be saved. Much less can men who do not embrace the Christian religion be saved, however diligent they may be to frame their lives according to the light of nature and the requirements of the religion they profess.
     
  12. BobRyan

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    This is a great highlight on Spurgeon's view of a key doctrine in Calvinism - as we find it in the "Baptist Confession of Faith"

    Clearly the statement above identified without question what Calvinism considers to be the determining element in all cases where one person is lost and another saved.


    But in so doing - Spurgeon is stuck at the point of making God the author of His own "lament".


     
    #12 BobRyan, Jan 10, 2015
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  13. Iconoclast

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    Your unbiblical and foolish "lament post" just demonstrates you are struggling mightily with the biblical God....

    You cutting and pasting your own post just makes people ignore it as it has been shot down over and over:thumbs::thumbs:
     
  14. BobRyan

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    [FONT=&quot][/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]


    “He CAME to HIS OWN and [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]His OWN received Him not[/FONT][FONT=&quot]” John 1[/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]Matt 23[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]37“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]38“Behold, your house is being left to you desolate![/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]Luke 7[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]28 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]When all the people and the tax collectors heard this, they acknowledged God’s justice, having been baptized with the baptism of John. [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]29 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]
    [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]Is 5:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    [/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]Response: [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot] Well the Calvinist would have an answer for God's question on that one. An answer contrived via “extreme inference” in places like Deut 5:29. Calvinism would inform the world – and God Himself of just what God did to cause the lamentable result that God is complaining about in t[FONT=&quot]he verse above[/FONT].

    [FONT=&quot]I[FONT=&quot]n Calvinism i[/FONT][/FONT]f the result is wrong if it is to be lamented if the question [FONT=&quot]is to be asked "What more could have been done" w[FONT=&quot]ell [/FONT][/FONT]then Calvinism argues He [FONT=&quot]knows exactly what He failed to do [/FONT] - [FONT=&quot]in effect [/FONT] sabotaging His own plans - the cause of His own "lament" - or at the very least - being forgetful to "do the necessary" as the saying goes in India.

    [FONT=&quot]================================

    [FONT=&quot]God's "lament" does not ask "what more could the LOST have done that they have not done" because He knows[FONT=&quot] exactly wh[FONT=&quot]at THEY could h[FONT=&quot]av[FONT=&quot]e [FONT=&quot]done.

    [FONT=&quot]Rather [FONT=&quot]G[FONT=&quot]od asks[FONT=&quot] 'What MOR[FONT=&quot]E could I HAVE done that I did not do?" -- the very ques[FONT=&quot]tion [FONT=&quot]all Calvinists claim to have the answer for.[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]



    A mean spirited post is not the solution to the Bible texts exposing the problem for Calvinism that you may have at first imagined-- obviously.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  15. Iconoclast

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    There is nothing mean spirited here.I am just the messenger.You asked a question ....you are given an answer and do nt like it
    you are spamming the board with your reposting of error.
     
  16. BobRyan

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    If that were true and your argument had the "ability" to provide a substantive response to the texts given above - you would have done it. -- obviously

    As it is -- "by their fruits you shall know them".

    you are obviously stuck because Spurgeon made my point for me in his statement as compared to the actual Bible texts exposing the flaw in Calvinism. Obviously.

    Do you really think that "more retreat tactics" by Calvinists on this board as they run away from the problem is going to be viewed as "compelling solution" by the unbiased objective readers?

    really??

    Seriously??

    who goes for that??

    Why not repent and seek for a Bible based answer instead??

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
    #16 BobRyan, Jan 11, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2015
  17. Iconoclast

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    Reformed

    Thanks for this helpful series of posts.
    Pastor Lawson takes the time to walk though what happened in His life and experience.

    Many who read it perhaps are reminded of how they also learned this way. Several have been taught however they were to begin with, but in time they had a desire to grow and learn of God's great work of redemption. It is always exciting to hear a solid testimony of God working in real time!

    As we know however...what the scripture teaches is the sole authority for faith and practice. Those like Pastor Lawson have come full circle however and It would seem God will continue using him and others like him to stabilize many who bounce of the shallow end of the pool, the entertainment and gimmicks and seek to be grounded and settled in the word.
     
  18. Iconoclast

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    yes that is very clear in this portion from post 5


    it sounds as if he was reacting in his own experience to the caricatures that many offer ..instead of facing and discussing truth.
     
  19. Iconoclast

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    BobRyan

    Until you can offer a real response to jn 12:32......no one is going to take you serious:thumbs:

    Quoting romans 2 and trying to introduce Heb 8....is fantasyland.It has nothing to do with Jn 12.....The reason is...you do not understand any of those portions of scripture.
    Do not blame that on Calvinists. You are following the teachings of a false teacher in Ellen G.White[ she claimed over 200 visions I am told:BangHead:

    Anyone holding to the teaching of that Church has a different authority than the bible alone, in that if you allow her visions to enter in...you dilute truth of necessity......that leads to your completely missing Romans 2.

    You are not going to give up her false teaching....so you at this point reject any sound teaching that comes your way.

    I was speaking with a JW one time and he wanted to discuss eschatology in detail.....I told him there was not much point, because as long as he denied Jesus as God ...his future was the second death.....so His "view" of end times did not matter at all...He needed to be saved and be given a new heart by Divine enablement being born from above.
    The natural man cannot understand the truths of the word of God.
    If he is devoid of the Spirit.....he will get it wrong everytime. 1cor 2...

    Have you ever seen what others say about this church..look what I found-


    http://www.exadventist.com/home/intro/tabid/64/default.aspx


    http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False Religions/Seventh-Day Adventist/sda_not_christian.htm
     
  20. BobRyan

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    This is a great highlight on Spurgeon's view of a key doctrine in Calvinism - as we find it in the "Baptist Confession of Faith"

    Clearly the statement above identified without question what Calvinism considers to be the determining element in all cases where one person is lost and another saved.


    But in so doing - Spurgeon is stuck at the point of making God the author of His own "lament".



    And it appears that Spurgeon endorsed that last sentence (regarding the sentiment in SavedByMercy's posts) at least to some degree in his comment above.



    I agree with that part of Iconoclast's post.

    And by way of example would add -- the information noted above - very "instructive".

    in Christ,

    Bob
     

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