Successful pope?

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by Ps104_33, Oct 5, 2003.

  1. Ps104_33

    Ps104_33
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    Current rumours are suggesting that the Roman Catholic world will soon be under the authority of a new ruler. Will another sick old man be elected to avoid another long long reign? Will he be a relatively young man to avoid having to watch the pope falling asleep in his chair in the middle of an address? Will he be, like the present pope, preoccupied with public appearances, and tradition while ignoring the Roman Catholic
    Churches internal strifes?
    Here is a quote from Pulitzer prize winning historian Garry Wills who wrote Why I am a Catholic, fron a June 2002 NPR interview.

    " He is a pope who has been widely disobeyed. Under him the priesthood has evaporated. The nuns have dissappeared. The discontent of the laity is very strong. The hierarchy has become corrupt with secrecy and unaccountability. I dont see how he can be considered a successful pope."

    What is the view of Catholics on this board. Do you consider him to be a successful pope?
     
  2. GraceSaves

    GraceSaves
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    What possible value does this thread have? And since when does winning a Pulitzer prize make one a faithful Catholic? You listed that like it should lend him credit in his Catholic viewpoints.

    This is like saying that Martin Luther King, Jr. was unsuccessful. I never saw the world suddenly shred it's racial hatred. One can be highly successful without delivering immediate results. The best results are those that are worked out through time; quick results are usually short lived, because society hasn't prepared itself for the shift.

    John Paul II has paved the road for a faithful Catholic future. Dissenters will always dissent, because they want it there way or the highway. In time, they will respond as Christians or they will leave. Because dissenters dissent does not mean a man has not successfully completed his mission.

    Also, you're opening remarks will terribly hateful. If you think comments like "Will another sick old man be elected to avoid another long long reign? Will he be a relatively young man to avoid having to watch the pope falling asleep in his chair in the middle of an address?" bear good Christian fruit, you might ought to check the barrel again; the apples are rotten. Is this how you regard all of the elderly? If it is, I pity those you encounter, because this is just horrid.
     
  3. WPutnam

    WPutnam
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    BRAVO to you, GraceSaves!

    Let me add one more accomplishment this pope is credited for, in conjunction with the efforts of one Ronald Reagan, then President of the United States - The fall of the Soviet Union!

    There are many who say, when John Paul dies and is eventually canonized as "Pope Saint John Paul II" that added to his full title, in our fond memory, will be...

    Pope Saint John Paul II, THE GREAT

    Great job, GraceSaves! [​IMG]

    God bless,

    PAX

    Bill+†+


    - Anima Christi -

    Soul of Christ, sanctify me.
    Body of Christ, save me.
    Blood of Christ, inebriate me.
    Water from the side of Christ, wash me.
    Passion of Christ, strengthen me.
    O good Jesus, hear me;
    Within Thy wounds hide me and permit
    me not to be separated from Thee.
    From the Wicked Foe defend me.
    And bid me to come to Thee,
    That with Thy Saints I may praise Thee,
    For ever and ever. Amen.
     
  4. mioque

    mioque
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    "Let me add one more accomplishment this pope is credited for, in conjunction with the efforts of one Ronald Reagan, then President of the United States - The fall of the Soviet Union!"
    You forget the most important part. JP's actions in this matter were deliberate. Reagan stumbled into his part of the succes completely by accident.
    Geo-politically speaking JPII's reign has been very succesfull. If he has succeeded as a religious leader remains to be seen, but those things take a lot of time to work themselves out. He has tried valiantly, so much is certain.

    "Will another sick old man be elected to avoid another long long reign?"
    Has been tried many times, the last time when an old obscure former diplomat whose only significant clame to fame was the saving of many Jewish lives during WWII was elected in 1958. Cardinal Roncalli (pope John XXIII) will go down in history as the most influential pope of the last century.
    " Will he be a relatively young man to avoid having to watch the pope falling asleep in his chair in the middle of an address?"
    Has also been tried many times, a young and energetic pope who died a relatively short time later in the arms of another man's wife comes to mind. It doesn't always work.
    " Will he be, like the present pope, preoccupied with public appearances, and tradition while ignoring the Roman Catholic
    Churches internal strifes?"
    :rolleyes: The current pope is a lot of things, but he is not like you describe him in that question. Your ignorance is showing. :eek:
     
  5. WPutnam

    WPutnam
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    Oh, I totally disagree with you here! But that gets us way off-topic, as I believe that Ronald Reagan was the best president we have had in the past century just concluded!

    Now here, you have my total agreement! [​IMG]

    I hold him in high regard as well, but time will tell if he would be more influencial then John Paul II himself, I think...

    Also, I must add, that John Paul II, when he was elected, was relatively young for a Cardinal! His reign lasted for up to 25 years, if he can survive to the aniversity date.

    I also recall John Paul I, relatiavely old then, died within a month of his election, as I recall... And that is why they went for a much younger man in the second consistory with John Paul II! [​IMG]

    I get the feeling that the author of this hit piece will never see any good in whoever is elected! His mind is made up that none of them will be great, accomplish much, and would be considered as useless in the modern world.

    Therefore, I join you in... :rolleyes:

    God bless,

    PAX

    Bill+†+


    Lord, grant me the serenity
    to accept the things I cannot change,
    the courage to change the things that I can,
    and the wisdom to know the difference.
    Living one day at a time,
    enjoying one moment at a time;
    accepting hardship as a pathway to peace;
    taking, as Jesus did, this sinful world as it is,
    not as I would have it;
    trusting that you will make all things right
    if I surrender to Your will;
    so that I may be reasonably happy in this life
    and supremely happy with You forever in the next.
    Amen.
     

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