Swelling not growing!

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Luke2427, Feb 13, 2011.

  1. Luke2427

    Luke2427
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    I do not think you need training to know your stuff. I do believe one of the benefits of training is to humble a man by showing him how little he really knows. Most of us, including myself, think we know a lot going into higher education and then are crushed to find out how dumb we really are. Age does the same thing for many. Humility is the beginning of knowledge (fear of the Lord).

    No one can call themselves humble who arrogantly ignores the wisdom of thousands of godly men before him over nearly two thousand years of church history and who just develops his own doctrines claiming the Holy Spirit gave them to him- doctrines which go against all major orthodox theological systems, including Arminianism.

    This type of arrogance is an American phenomenon. It is killing the church in this country and destroying our culture.

    The growth that this Independent, Non-denominational and Pentecostal thinking has brought over the past 100 years is nothing, imo, but swelling- a symptom of disease.


    The church in America would be better off slimmer and leaner and more doctrinally sound.

    Romans 16
    17Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. 18For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.


    The blunt communication of truth is like aggressive antibiotics for the Body of Christ. It will shrink the body (not literally for the body of Christ is made up of true believers- but it will give the APPEARANCE of shrinking), it turns off those who weaken the body and runs them off, but the shrinkage is the removal of swelling. The smaller body will be healthier and stronger.

    God, give us godly men who humbly, but boldly, herald the truth, the faith once delivered to the saints, without apology!


    II Corinthians 3:12 Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
     
  2. saturneptune

    saturneptune
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    We all have lots to learn, in fact, in this flawed world we live in, the learning never stops. I have heard lots about the knowledge we will have when we are finally in the presence of the Lord, however, I have always wondered and actually think learning will continue forever. I am not really sure about what we will know in heaven, but obviously more than now. Learning from the Lord I would hope is an eternity long process. The things we will experience there such as joy, peace, and love we can only get a glimpse of now.

    I also agree that the orthodoxy built up in the early church is for the most part sound doctrine, and should be. The churches in Acts for example were taught by the apostles, most of whom saw the Lord during His earthly ministry. However, as time marches forward, we really messed up what the Lord had left. It did not take very long to start splitting into denominations and sub-demonimnations motivated by the "I am right and you are wrong" syndrome. Today we have hundreds of denominations and thousands of sub groups. It is always great to play the what if game. What if we had followed the Spirit throughout all the years, we would have lots fewer groups. Actually we should have had local churches pretty much in agreement with each other.

    If we look at this board for example, from members who believe basically the same, the number of issues that trigger a hot button is amazing, but lends to understanding why we are the way we are today. To mention a few, Calvinism, Creation, End Times, Bible versions, Landmarkism, drinking and other vices. It goes on and on.

    There is no one that needs to learn more than me. However, I have seen those without much education with great insight, and then again, those who claimed to have this or that degree that were still in the drinking milk stage of spiritual maturity as Paul describes it.

    As I explained before, it took a while for me to learn on this board how to distinguish between those who were troublemakers and those who were passionate about this issue or that. I still miss it at times.

    All I know is that I have lots of friends here, that gave me great support after the operation about a year ago. I also have a family and local church (ie Tom Butler for one) that gave me great support. All have been very understanding as my personality, sense of humor and other things have changed from before.

    The bottom line is that for those on this board who are sincere in their Christian belief, there is room for us to teach and learn from each other. There are certain issues I will not debate or discuss, and they revolve around core beliefs such as the Divinity of Jesus, inerrency of the Bible, God's plan of Salvation, etc., but for the issues listed above, I will talk to anyone.

    Another thing I have learned, for those who take the issues like Calvinism and move them to the core beliefs catagory (I define core beliefs as a belief that could change someone's salvation by that belief), I tend to not enter that discussion, as we look at that issue on a totally different plane (ie essential vs non-essential)

    God bless you and your family.
     
    #2 saturneptune, Feb 13, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 13, 2011
  3. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    Amen Brother Luke :jesus:
     
  4. saturneptune

    saturneptune
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    I have actually had private messages at various points in time asking me if my BB name was because I either 1. practiced astrology 2. felt a need to worship the planets
     
  5. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    Great insight my brother.... I assume you've joined the ranks of members of the zipper club (ala Larry King & yours truly) ?
     
  6. saturneptune

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    I did send a friend request to you.

    Thanks for the comments.
     
  7. Salty

    Salty
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    lets see - From the Sun, Saturn is planet #6 and Neptune is # 8 - away from the sun they are # 1 & 3 when all totaled = 18, unless you count Pluto then it would be 2 & 4 and the total = 24 - oh shoot, what are we talking about anyways:laugh:
     
  8. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    Are you aware we have been friends for months? If I clicked on the right buttons , we still should be. you still in to astronomy? Sky has been nice for viewing the stars the last few nights.:wavey:
     
  9. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    If it helps Im an Aquarius & I have an aquarium...LOL
     
  10. Luke2427

    Luke2427
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    To put it succinctly, we have disease of arrogance and ignorance that has caused the Church in America to swell and give the appearance of growth, but in all actuality the swelling is a symptom of this deadly disease that is killing our culture.

    Independents, Non-denominationalists and Pentecostals seem to be the primary carriers and spreaders of this nation killing disease.

    While this is certainly not the only infirmity the American Church is afflicted with (many orthodox denominations have a spiritual DEADNESS that is driving people to these other unorthodox movements), it does seem to be the PRIMARY ailment of our culture.
     
  11. Old Union Brother

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    Luke wonderful insights and you do lead me to study more

    saturnneptune I have taken the same stance as you about posting.

    EWF you have caused me to think ponder and pray about many things you say one here and I am thankful for that.

    Peace and prayers
     
  12. saturneptune

    saturneptune
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    The story is like this. I have always had astronomy as a hobby. The first time (years ago) when I first had to make a user ID, Saturn came to mind. Of course, the name was taken up, so I noticed the last letter n, and just added neptune, so it has stuck every since. I use it for lots of things, including email, and other talk forums.
     
  13. saturneptune

    saturneptune
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    Sorry about that chief.
     
  14. saturneptune

    saturneptune
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    Are you sure? If everyone is not aware, and I just found out, they redid the dates for the Zodiac in relation to birth dates. For some reason they added a 13th sign.

    New Zodiac Signs - Has Your Sign Changed?72
    rate or flag this pageTweet thisBy Xeract

    Have yours changed?
    It might sound surprising, but the new zodiac signs have been released and you may no longer be the sign that you thought you were! According to astrologers, the moon has recently cause the Earth’s axis to wobble, which means that the new Zodiac dates related to each sign have changed by up to a month. You may find that your sign has changed, meaning that you’re no longer a Capricorn or Pisces!

    Update: This change only applies if you're born after the change date. How this can be the case when the Earth's axis has certainly not suddenly changed I'm not sure.


    There is also some discussion about whether an entirely NEW zodiac sign is in existence. The sign is called Ophiuchus, and is said to be the new 13th star sign.


    Zodiac Books
    Meditations on the Signs of the Zodiac
    Amazon Price: $15.44
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    The Taste of Night (Sign of the Zodiac, Book 2)
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    All Around the Zodiac: Exploring Astrology's Twelve Signs
    Amazon Price: $8.00
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    New Zodiac Signs
    Here’s a list of the updated new zodiac signs:

    January 20-February 16 - Capricorn
    February 16-March 11 - Aquarius
    March 11-April 18 - Pisces
    April 18-May 13 - Aries
    May 13-June 21 - Taurus
    June 21-July 20 - Gemini
    July 20-August 10 - Cancer
    August 10-September 16 - Leo
    September 16-October 30 - Virgo
    October 30-November 23 - Libra
    November 23-December 17 - Scorpio
    December 17-January 20 – Sagittarius
     
  15. idonthavetimeforthis

    idonthavetimeforthis
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    Amen, brother!
     
  16. saturneptune

    saturneptune
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  17. glfredrick

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    Luke, I believe you are correct. One caveat... No one is immune. Sometimes a great education lets us know just how far we have yet to go to grasp all the various conflicts and the wealth of knowledge and wisdom that has been passed down to us through the ages, and at other times, the education itself can puff up.

    I've been blessed to study under some of the brightest lights in the history of God's church -- men who are bringing God's church back to God and God's Word both through courageous stances on the Bible and through scholarship second to none in history. In every encounter, I am amazed to find just how far I have yet to travel to even grasp some of what these amazing men have already assimilated. We'll open the Text together and they teach with authority from both knowing that what they speak is accurate and true -- and from walking with God for decades. Their work has been tested -- peer reviewed -- and has stood as God's truth revealed and properly apprehended.

    One would hardly realize the depths of these men if one met them in the hall... In many a case, one would be hard put to realize that they are even professors. They are humble church men who love God first and above all, then, who have followed God's calling to teach the Word to those whom God has sent their way. They don't dress flashy. They don't preen. They are just regular men with utterly fantastic minds, devoted to God and God's glory.

    What is lacking in so many -- here and elsewhere -- is the desire to actually KNOW a doctrinal topic. They fly off the cuff, regurgitate what has been handed down to them by a pastor who may or may not be educated and tested himself, and fail to realize (from their lack of study) that they merely repeat ancient heresies. Worse, they copy/paste from web sites that do likewise and worse.

    IF we have a "bone to pick" it ought to be against heresy and unrighteousness -- not against our brothers and sisters in the Lord. Yet, I see often that there are those here who indeed have a "bone to pick" against those holding this or that theology. Our calling and our task should be to present God's Word -- accurately, fully, and comprehensively -- not setting that same Word against itself and against others.
     
  18. Luke2427

    Luke2427
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    I agree 100%.:thumbsup:
     
  19. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    Im not sure what you mean by that Brother.....is that a good or bad thing, LOL

    Seriously though. I believe that what Ive learned later in life mirrors what BB Warfield recognized .... that the gospel is not really the gospel unless it is a gospel of grace; ie.... the gospel is only good news if it announces what God has done to save sinners. and if that is true, then the gospel stands & falls with the doctrines of grace.
     
  20. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Very accurate & thought provoking commentary my Brother in Christ. I'm glad to know you & I always learn from you (which I expect allot of it is passed down from other wise & humble men).... Bless all! :godisgood:
     

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