Taking Back Our Fiscal Future

Discussion in 'Politics' started by KenH, Mar 31, 2008.

  1. KenH

    KenH
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2002
    Messages:
    32,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    #1 KenH, Mar 31, 2008
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2008
  2. billwald

    billwald
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2000
    Messages:
    11,414
    Likes Received:
    0
    "Congress and the president enact explicit long-term budgets for Medicare, Medicaid, and
    Social Security that are sustainable, set limits on automatic spending growth, and reduce
    the relatively favorable budgetary treatment of these programs compared with other
    types of expenditures.'

    SS is a smoke screen that is fixable by eliminating the cap and raising the retirement age as life span raises. It never was intended to provide a good retirement. Why doesn't the govt ever warn about the Army going broke? There is nothing special about SS. The Treasury will write any check that Congress orders it to write.

    Medicare and medicaid are moral issues. Are the taxpayers obligated to pay to extend human life as along as it is technically possible?

    It is the war that is breaking the country, not the helping of the poor people.
     
  3. JustChristian

    JustChristian
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2007
    Messages:
    3,833
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sometimes I wonder just what kind of a discussion board this is. Questions about why we should NOT start wars. Why shouldn't we fund the military over poor people why can't afford medical care. No, taxpayers aren't obligated to keep people alive. I would think this would be a priority for Christians but hey maybe I've been trying to be too much like Christ. I need to think more like the Pharisees.
     
  4. TomVols

    TomVols
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2000
    Messages:
    11,170
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, I don't agree with Billwald much..if ever. While it is the responsibility of Christians to promote life and welfare, the a U.S. Constitutional government may not have that burden. Billwald is incorrect that the war is breaking us relative to SS, Medicare, etc. Those programs were going broke long before Iraq, Afghan, etc., because of fiscal mismanagement.

    I think the report's summary is telling. Is it me or do bullet points one and three seem a bit contradictory?

    "• [FONT=Georgia,Georgia]Congress and the president enact explicit long-term budgets for Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security that are sustainable, set limits on automatic spending growth, and reduce the relatively favorable budgetary treatment of these programs compared with other types of expenditures.
    • The programs be reviewed on a regular schedule by the Social Security and Medicare Trustees or the Congressional Budget Office to determine whether they will remain within budgeted amounts.
    • Significant long-term deviations from budgeted amounts trigger automatic adjustments in benefits, premiums, provider payments, or other revenues. These adjustments could only be over-ridden by an explicit vote of Congress and acceptance by the president. "


    IOW, we should have firm budgets, but let's open the door for deviations that would trigger adjustments. That seems to be Washington's way. "We're not going to change this...unless we change it"

    That said, the basic premise - that the "autopilot" we have SS, Medicare and Medicaid on is killing these programs - is well taken and worth saying. We need to make some hard calls to ensure fiscal health to our nation. I don't know that I agree with some of the biases of the report, but I don't see how anyone could disagree with the proposal's thesis.
    [/FONT]
     
  5. dragonfly

    dragonfly
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    1,594
    Likes Received:
    0
    Good post! :thumbs:
     
  6. Martin

    Martin
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2005
    Messages:
    5,228
    Likes Received:
    0
    ==Taxation and charity are two different things from a Biblical perspective. Therefore your whole point is unBiblical. It is fine for the government to help the truly needed with our tax dollars, but that is not charity. That is a tax that the government uses for a good cause. But it is not charity. Christian charity can never be done through a tax of any form. Christian charity is done as a person "has purposed in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver" (2Cor 9:7). That rules out charity being done through taxation since all taxes are required (done under compulsion). If someone wants to be like Christ they need to do acts of charity (giving money, time, energy, etc) and stop waiting for the government to do it form them. If more of us Christians would practice charity then maybe the government could stop having to tax us as much.

    Paying taxes is not charity.
     
    #6 Martin, Apr 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 1, 2008
  7. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    38,287
    Likes Received:
    780
    Well said!:thumbs:
     
  8. dragonfly

    dragonfly
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    1,594
    Likes Received:
    0
    If the truly needy waited for the church to help, they would starve to death! Thank God for government programs that help meet their needs.
     
  9. Martin

    Martin
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2005
    Messages:
    5,228
    Likes Received:
    0
    ==Waiting for the government is dangerous as Katrina proved. Many churches are willing to help, but a person has to ask for help. If people don't know, people can't help. However I will agree that more Christians should do acts of charity. I repeat again: Paying taxes is not charity.
     
  10. dragonfly

    dragonfly
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    1,594
    Likes Received:
    0
    I believe in paying taxes, churches helping the poor and governmental aid to those who need it.
     
  11. billwald

    billwald
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2000
    Messages:
    11,414
    Likes Received:
    0
    The medical costs for the last two or three years of my father's life cost the taxpayers more than his total gross pay in his entire life.

    Don't think any hospital charges less than $1,000/ day for room and board. ICU, $10,000/day

    I probably made a $million total in wages over my working career. How many millions a year should the taxpayers be willing to pay to keep me alive?

    A person who doesn't have any reason to lie about it says that once a month he goes to a clinic and gets one pill. He then gets a bill for $10,000 which he throws away. A month later he gets a bill for $1,000 marked "paid in full." he doesn't pay anything.

    How many $1000/month pills can the taxpayers afford?
     
  12. dragonfly

    dragonfly
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    1,594
    Likes Received:
    0
    As many as are necessary. The problem is that the pill shouldn't cost one million dollars, to use your analogy.
     

Share This Page

Loading...