Tammy Faye and her repentance

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by tommie, Jul 22, 2007.

  1. tommie

    tommie
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    Tammy Faye and her then husband Jimmy Baker stole millions of dollars from people who "bought" into their scheme to build a Christian 'Disney' type retreat. People bought times shares so they could vacation for one or more weeks a year. My disabled mother bought 3 of these time shares for my my sister, my brother and myself. It was my wedding gift. You know the story, those two stole the money and bought solid gold bathroom faucets for themselves instead. They both apologized, after they got caught but have never repaid the money they stole, unlike the tax collector who repaid 7 times what he stole. Jimmy now has a new tv ministry and tammy was in the public eye making lots of money, I suppose. If these two don't or didn't, try to repay what they stole, are they repentant. I know God is the judge, I am just having a very hard time forgiving them.
     
  2. broccoli

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    forgiveness, for me at least, has less to do with the outward displays of remorse, repentance, or the like from the transgressing party and more to do with the heart of the the one who was wronged. how could we ever repay God for all we've done against Him? and yet He forgave and continues to forgive us for every wrong. it's this example, i think, we need to keep in mind.
     
  3. webdog

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    I hope you wouldn't start this intentionally knowing she just passed away...
     
  4. tommie

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    webdog, I knew she past away, that is what got me thinking about this. Why would before she died be any different than after she pasted away?
     
  5. preachinjesus

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    I agree with the above thoughts, that while forgiveness is more about allowing someone to be in a right standing before God. Frankly, while not affected like you by these two (and their friends), I can have no problem forgiving them for their actions...but never endorsing them for ministry again.

    I'll take a though stance here and suggest that Jim Bakker has no place in a new television ministry. He has completely discreditted himself and should be left out of a prominent ministry position. Imho, he can certainly be in ministry, but it should be in an obscure place and role (not pastoral) until he can be redeemed for his horrible actions in the name of Jesus Christ.

    Forgiveness has more to do with us being free of hate for someone than it does for them being at ease.

    Just my opinion. This whole Jim Bakker thing has really changed the ministry world (for the worse) for those of us in vocational ministry...we are immediately suspect by some because of it.
     
  6. webdog

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    If you knew, how is this thread bringing glory to God? Have you repented of all of your past sin? Who are we to say who has or hasn't repented? "Kick 'em while they're down (or dead)" I guess... :tear:
     
  7. tommie

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    Webdog, I thought this was a discussion board. I don't understand what you mean by bringing glory to God through this discussion. Tammy Faye and her husband did bad things and I am having a hard time with it and how it effected me and my family. Television ministers dnn't always have my respect, just as preachinjesus said, unfortunately.( I love to listen to Adrian Rogers though. wow!) I will always be jaded. You can be as angry as you want but it doesn't change anything whether Tammy is alive or dead.

    This is for all: Did she truely repent by not repaying the money she and her husband stole from good faith people? Do you have to try to make things right after you have repented or should the injured person just lay down and roll over and say it is ok even though they know in their heart that not repentance has really been given with no action.
     
  8. webdog

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    Please, tell me how anyone besides her and God can know that answer to this? Did she steal anything from you personally? If not, why do you care, and if so, why haven't you forgiven her yet after all these years?
     
  9. tommie

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    She and her husband did steal from me personally. My mother, who was in a nursing home, living on next to nothing, bought 3 time shares. One for me, my sister and my brother. She was to give the share to us for a wedding gift. I did get the paper though. They were the worst of thieves at that time. It is just like it happened yesterday even though mother has pasted away now. Even if it hadn't happened to me, so what. It happened to others just as poor as my mom. It hurt her in many many ways just as it hurt others. I want to know it someone should try to make things right, especially people (jimmy baker)who have a tv ministry as we speak.
     
    #9 tommie, Jul 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 22, 2007
  10. TCGreek

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    1. In all due respect, I am going to ask you to kindly leave these people alone.

    2. Yes, they have done wrong. We all know that. But don't let their repentance or lack thereof, steal your joy.

    3. In fact, your statement "I am just having a very hard time forgiving them" suggests that you are the one who has a problem with them and not God.

    4. You are held bondage by this thought of yours. Forgive them, and free yourself. Isn't that what forgiveness is all about?

    5. In the end, yours or our feeling about them is not going to matter in the light of eternity.

    6. Let God take care of the God stuff (Eph 4:32).
     
    #10 TCGreek, Jul 22, 2007
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  11. mcdirector

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    I can forgive someone and decide not to do business with them. I can forgive a preacher and decide not to go to his church any more. I can forgive Tammy Faye for her part -- whatever that was -- and then choose not to have a part in her ministry. There are lots of reasons to make those decisions outside of forgiveness. There are earthly consequences that follow. I can forgive and that doesn't mean I have to ignore consequeces. I can forgive someone for stealing. That doesn't mean I'll hand over my finances.

    BUT Me not letting go only hurts me - but that's been said already. I am only responsible for me.

    I've seen upclose and personal what happens when someone gets bogged down in feeling betrayed by someone else's behavior. It's awful and it's something that I truly believe could happen to any of us. It can turn the most rational and sane of us into small and bitter beings. That is a strong word of caution. You have to give this to God.
     
    #11 mcdirector, Jul 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 22, 2007
  12. tommie

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    mcdirector, I agree with everything you said. Thanks

    TCGreek, You first statement, meant to me: Forget it happened. Is that what you meant? I do appreciate the rest of the post though. Thanks
     
  13. TCGreek

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    1. Not at all!

    2. I do not agree with the statement "Forgive and Forget."

    3. You will remember that it happened, but ask God to help you get past the pain and bitterness that came from it.

    4. mcdirector alluded to that idea.
     
  14. Amy.G

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    I really like this quote. It applies to a lot of stuff we go through in life. I want to remember this. Thanks. :)
     
  15. just-want-peace

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    tommie, you are responsible for you, and you alone. If you choose to hold a grudge against Jim & Tammie Faye, you are just feeding a cancer of your own making.

    God didn't say that you had to like what another did/does to you; only that you forgive if asked, and if not asked, forgive anyway. Forgiving or not does not affect the other person if they either don't know about your feelings, or if they just don't care. This is for YOUR well being, not revenge, justice, or righting the wrong, but for not letting anger emasculate your soul.

    Remedy: Pray for Jim B now, for his success in his ministry, that he will truly lead people to God, that he will become a better servant of His as time passes, AND for forgiveness for you (from God) for not doing this BEFORE TF's demise.

    I think you will find that one of two things will occur:
    1) You will develop a strong forgiving spirit toward J & TF, OR
    2) You will find it totally impossible to pray for him(them)!

    Been there, done that, so I can say with some authority that it is IMPOSSIBLE to hate (yep, that's what it sounds like) someone AND pray for them at the same time.

    Hard to do? You betcha!!!

    So just let the Holy Spirit through you do it to start. But you've got to be willing to admit that your feelings are wrong, and have a sincere desire to make things right with Him regarding this issue.

    Believe me, if/when you do, you'll be totally amazed at how free you then feel; just like a 1,000 # weight lifted off your shoulders.

    You talk about taking advantage of a poor ($ wise) woman, your mother -- I feel the exact same way about most politicians as they are nothing more than merchants of fear to keep the gullible in submission to be able to "LORD" it over them. I have to constantly remind myself that I am not responsible for them, but that they will answer to God for their own actions in His time.

    Let Him handle the justice part; don't feel that you have to worry about all the injustice in the world. HE'S got it all well in hand, even though we can't see it now!

    MARA NATHA!!!
     
  16. tommie

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    Amy G, TCGreek did post a great scripture. One that needs to be seen daily.


    just-want-peace, Your post made me cry.
     
  17. Amy.G

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    Tommie is right. This is a wonderful post. Absolute truth!
    It's hard (really hard, sometimes) to let go. But, you're right that God has it all well in hand. Wise words. :)
     
  18. Analgesic

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    Regardless of the forgiveness issue, I think the question of repentance remains an excellent one. Can she be said to have truly repented if she made no effort to make restitution?
     
  19. tommie

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    Analgesic,
    I guess this is where God is the judge and we are just to let go of the problem and forgive.
     
  20. mcdirector

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    ;)

    ~~~~~~~~~~~
     

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