The forgiveness of sins !

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by savedbymercy, May 26, 2012.

  1. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    Acts 13:38

    Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:

    The word preached here is the greek word kataggellō and means:


    to announce, declare, promulgate, make known

    2) to proclaim publicly, publish

    3) to denounce, report, betray

    The word conveys the idea of making something known ! What is being made known or declared, or published to some is that they have by the grace of God, and through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, they have the forgiveness of all their sins ! Eph 1:7

    In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

    This is not an offer of forgiveness of sins that is contingent upon any conditions of men, not faith, not repentance, not water baptism, but solely upon the Blood of Christ shed on their behalf, the blood of the Covenant Matt 26:28

    28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.


    The remission of sins is the same as the forgiveness of sins !

    All those whom Christ died for, shed His Blood for have before the Justice of God, and His Holy Law, they have forgiveness of sins before they are even born into this world as sinners ! It has not been made known to them until they are born again from above and the Gospel of their Salvation is preached unto them !
     
  2. savedbymercy

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    There was Legal forgiveness of the sins of the elect before the world began because of the Everlasting Covenant of Grace, when Christ was established as the Surety of the Elect or of the Sheep, and therefore no sin of theirs could be legally imputed to their Charge, but unto the charge of their Surety, so the Elect were forgiven of all Trespasses, before they actually Trespassed in Adam! When they Trespaased in Adam, God could not legally charge them with sin. David understood this Transaction and wrote Ps 32:1-2

    Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.

    2 Blessed is the man unto whom the Lord imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.
     
  3. savedbymercy

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    He obtained Eternal Redemption for them !

    Some may wonder why I am mentioning Eternal Redemption when discussing a point about forgiveness ? Heb 9:12

    12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

    Look what Christ accomplished solely by His Own Blood , He obtained Eternal Redemption for us ! Who are the Us ? It's everyone Christ offered Himself for Heb 10:10 and who eventually become Believers ! However, the Eternal Redemption is theirs before coming Believers, because of Christ's Own Blood. Here are a few more verses that speaks to Christ's Own Blood and what it did accomplish ! See Acts 20:28;Heb 13:12;Rev 1:5

    Now lets look at this word redemption in Heb 9:12, For it is the greek word lytrōsis and means:


    a ransoming, redemption

    2) deliverance, esp. from the penalty of sin

    Eternal Forgiveness, as regards to the penalty of sin ! Every single individual that Christ died for, He has obtained for them, by His Own Blood" Eternal Deliverance from the penalty of all their sins ! Their slate is clear, nothing for God to lay to their charge. Also everyone who Christ died for, in behalf of, when they are sinners, children of wrath by Nature as others, and unbelievers, they , even though it has not been revealed to them yet, they Have Eternal Deliverance from their sins on their slate, accomplished by Christ's own Blood !
     
  4. Yeshua1

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    until the Lord actually declares them to be righteousness, when they place faith in jesus, do not have forgiveness of their sins!

    As ALL born in adam as sinners, ONLY reborn into jesus and reborn by God as saints by/thru placing faith in jesus!
     
  5. savedbymercy

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    Preach to you the forgiveness of sins !

    Acts 13:38

    Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:

    The word preached here is the word kataggellō


    to announce, declare, promulgate, make known

    2) to proclaim publicly, publish

    3) to denounce, report, betray

    God through the preaching of His servants was making known, reporting to them Christ had died for, the forgiveness of their sins.

    They were not making a offer of forgiveness to anyone who would meet conditions, thats a false Gospel, but through Preaching, He makes known the good news to them Jesus Christ did redeem by His Blood, the forgiveness of their sins Eph 1:7

    In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

    These things we do not know until God makes them known through Preaching ! And then Faith comes by Hearing, Hearing the Word of God. The Word of God makes known the forgiveness of our sins according to the riches of His Grace, displayed through the man Jesus Christ ! Those who teach an condition is required of men whom Christ died for and redeemed by His Blood, before they have remission or forgiveness of sins, they are teaching another Gospel, preaching another Gospel !
     
  6. The Biblicist

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    Half truth is a whole lie and that is what you are teaching a half truth.

    All that occurred before the world began was a "COVENANT" agreement between the Persons of the Triune God in regard to redemption of the elect.

    The Covenant agreement by the Son to redeem the elect no more justified or redeemed the elect before the world began than the Covenant Agreement by the Spirit to regenerate and glorify the elect actual regenerated and glorified them before the world began. Stupidity is the basis of your reasoning and perversion is the basis of your interpretation of scripture.

    "I have PURPOSED it; I SHALL do it" - Isa. 46:11 Here is the Biblical balance!

    The Old Testament saints where saved on the basis of "PROMISE" not on the basis of FULFILLMENT already of the promise!!
     
    #6 The Biblicist, Jun 1, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 1, 2012
  7. savedbymercy

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    the bib

    Correct, and of which Covenant the sins of the Elect were agreed not to be imputed on them, but on Christ !
     
  8. The Biblicist

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    False! No such agreement was made! The agreement was that Christ would come and redeem them from sin. Sin was imputed to them or else they could never be regarded as "sinners." They were under condemnation or else they could never be called even as others "children of WRATH."

    You simply do not know what you are talking about!
     
  9. savedbymercy

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    the bib

    Then you do not know what the everlasting covenant is, neither do you know what Christ being made a surety means !
     
  10. The Biblicist

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    What I know is that you don't know what you are talking about. A Covenant is an agreement between two or more person to COMMIT to something not to have already done something.

    Go learn what this means - "I have PURPOSED it, I WILL do it" - Learn the difference between purpose and fulfillment.
     
  11. savedbymercy

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    the bib

    You do not know what you are talking about. Christ was made Surety for the Sins of the Elect before the World began in the Everlasting Covenant. God purposed before the world began to not impute the sins of the Elect to them, but unto their Surety. That was both their Forgiveness and Justification before the world began !
     
  12. The Biblicist

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    Everyone capable of reading elementary English on this board and capable of exercising common sense knows the difference between an "agreement" (covenant) to commit to do something versus the fulfillment of that committment. Apparently you lack both elementary English and common sense skills.

    1. The Covenant itself demands that sin was indeed imputed to them or else no covenant would have been necessary in the first place. If sin was not imputed to them then God could not justly condemn them "sinners."

    2. The Covenant committment by the Son before the world began did not in and of itself before the world began redeem them any more than no more than the covenant committment by the Holy Spirit to regenerate, justify and glorify in and of itself already regenerated, justified and glorified them before the world began.

    Go learn what God means when he says "I HAVE purposed it; I WILL do it" as you don't understand the difference between God's eternal purpose and the actual fulfillment of that purpose. You believe the purpose needs no fulfillment because just for God to purpose something IS its fulfillment. That is simply stupidity on display and God repudiates that stupidity when he says "I HAVE purpose it; I WILL DO IT" rather than how you interpret it which would make his words say "I HAVE PURPOSED it; I HAVE DONE it."

    Furthermore, the scriptuers clearly and repeatedly teach "justification BY faith" and yet your heresy must deny such a thing actually exists as you have them already justified APART FROM faith before the world began.
     
    #12 The Biblicist, Jun 2, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 2, 2012
  13. savedbymercy

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    the bib

    Once Christ committed to do and be the Surety of the sins of the Elect, as soon as they committed a transgression, God looked to the Surety for Restitution, and not the actual transgressors !
     
  14. The Biblicist

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    That is not what the Scriptures say or teach:

    Rom. 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

    God set forth Christ to be a propitiation (satisfaction) THROUGH FAITH in his blood.

    God remitted sins previous to the cross "THROUGH THE FORBEARANCE of God" based upon the PROMISE of Christ's coming and shedding His blood.
     
  15. savedbymercy

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    Regarding the Everlasting Covenant !

    Regarding the Everlasting Covenant or the New Covenant as it was revealed in Time, of which the Lord Jesus Christ is the guarantor or Surety Heb 7:22

    By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

    who in time did fulfilled all of its stipulations and conditions of that Covenant by Hos spotless Life of Obedience both active and passive, to God's Moral Law and by the Sacrifice of Himself for its violation, for the sins of all God's Elect, which were laid to His Charge, yet though all the stipulations are completed in time, the responsibility of meeting them was given before time. We know this from such statements from the Saviour's mouth such as Jn 10:17-18


    17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.

    18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

    We believe this commandment was received by Christ of the Father before the World began in the agreements of the Everlasting Covenant, so it can be written that the lamb was slain [By Covenant Agreement] from the foundation of the World or as Peter stated in 1 Pet 1:20

    Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

    That this commandment is what constituted Him the Surety of the Covenant Heb 7:22 and hence, that Surety-Ship being actual and real and legally binding . It because of its binding nature between the Triune God, especially the the Father and the Son, it prevented and legal liability to any of those He was made a Surety in behalf of, their Trespasses, sins, and iniquities they would partake of in the time state, the legal guilt and condemnation that was incurred, could not without violating the Covenant, could be laid personally to their charge, even though the Payment of restitution and redemption price was yet to be in the fulness of time, yet God could only look to Christ for payment, and so not imputing their trespasses unto them 2 Cor 5:19, which was their Justification and forgiveness !
     
  16. The Biblicist

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    Look at the context. It is talking about what he accomplished in time and space by His WORK as the HIGH PREIST not what he agreed to do before the world began!

    Look at the text. The text says he "was made" (gimomai - to become) the surety through his High Preistly work.

    Go learn the difference between purpose and fulfillment and go learn the difference between the POSITION of High Priest and the WORK of High Priest. The surety was provided by his WORK as High Priest. He did not fulfil the WORK of High Priest before the world began but only PURPOSED it but fulfilled it in time. - "I have purposed it; I WILL DO it."
     
  17. savedbymercy

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    the bib

    I already have, where you think I found the verse at !
     
  18. The Biblicist

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    You are solid evidence that looking at something does not mean understanding what is seen.
     
  19. savedbymercy

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    You have no ideal what the Everasting Covenant is ! It became a Covenant Engagenment with stipulations and binding agreements before the world began !

    Within it, God purposed not to impute sin on the elect, but instead upon their Surety. Right after the sin of Adam, God revealed the Covenant him, that through his seed would come the one who would bruise the head of the serpent, that had been determined before adam was created. When Adam sinned and the Elect in Him, God looked to Christ for restitution, not the Elect !
     
  20. savedbymercy

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    In the engagements of the Everlasting Covenant, The Lord Jesus Christ had all the sins of the Elect Imputed to His Charge, that is why He was a Surety of the Covenant. If we may borrow a Illustration from scripture we would look at Prov 6:1

    My son, if thou be surety for thy friend, if thou hast stricken thy hand with a stranger,

    Of course Christ did not strike hands with a stranger but with the Father, this means He became obligated legally for their sin debt against God's law, yes, even before the World began. This was an Everlasting Covenant stipulation.

    Now once this striking of Hands took place in the Eternal Agreement, God must look to Christ for any sin that will be committed by those He was a Surety in behalf of ! Once Adam sinned and the Elect in Him, it was laid to Christ's Charge ! Adam, nor the Elect in Him became Legally condemned for their transgression ! Why ? Because Christ did already !
     

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