The funny NIV thread

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by xdisciplex, Dec 20, 2006.

  1. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    Let's explore the NIV. :wavey:

    It's really totally accurate and doesn't change doctrines at all. Come and see!

    Can God lie?

    NIV


    Titus 1
    2a faith and knowledge resting on the hope of eternal life, which God, who does not lie, promised before the beginning of time,

    I guess this means he could if he wanted to. But he doesn't do it, but who knows maybe one day he does it....

    Let's see what the KJV says:

    Tit 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;




    Who has to be born again? Nicodemus?

    KJV

    Joh 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
    Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
    Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
    Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye (plural) must be born again.

    NIV

    5Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 6Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit[b] gives birth to spirit. 7You should not be surprised at my saying, 'You[c] must be born again.'

    From the text it sounds as if Jesus is only referring to Nicodemus....
    But the christians in these times think that thou and thee, you and ye are too hard words to understand...

    Why did Jesus come?

    KJV

    Mat 9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

    NIV

    13But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

    Oh, he came to call sinners, but for what? For dinner? :confused:
    This is cool. Hey you sinners! :wavey:
    I came to call you.


    KJV

    Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

    Now let's see what the NIV did to this powerful,majestic verse....

    NIV

    12For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

    It totally ruined it. Living and active sounds like nothing. And what does penetrate mean? When I hear the word penetrate I think of a penetrating scent or something like this, nothing positive. And what are the attitudes of the heart? Why do they have to water everything down? Are the people too dumb to understand what intents are? Are they too dumb to understand what to pierce means? Oh boy. The NIV really upsets me.
     
  2. Helen

    Helen
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/Helen2.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2001
    Messages:
    11,703
    Likes Received:
    1
    xdx, you have a long, long way to go. Why don't you start spending as much time with the Lord as you do here?
     
  3. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    Maybe I should ask you the same. Maybe then God would tell you that the KJV is superior. :smilewinkgrin:
    Wasn't this what you wanted to imply? That if I only spent more time with God he would tell me that I'm wrong.
     
  4. Helen

    Helen
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/Helen2.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2001
    Messages:
    11,703
    Likes Received:
    1
    You spending time with the Lord has nothing to do with the superiority or inferiority of any text. It has to do with you getting to know your Lord and God and Redeemer. That is absolutely priimary. Read the King James front to back. Then read it again. And spend time in prayer with the Lord. Ask Him for wisdom and understanding. Forget all those television programs. Forget the arguments about this and that. Go straight to the Source and get to know Him yourself. That is what He wants. That is what the Bible is for. And, in your heart, that is what you are so hungry for, too.
     
  5. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,766
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes, but the problem is that when I read the bible I get tons of questions and in order to ask those questions I have to go online and ask them.
     
  6. bound

    bound
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2006
    Messages:
    664
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi Xdisciplex,

    The whole KJV versus NIV is a wonderful distraction for the real work of bearing the fruit of the Spirit in our lives and in the lives of others. Perhaps these 'canned' arguments are best left to others more scholarly than ourselves?

    Open you heart to God and He will enter. You don't need to grasp for the 'right' translations, or the 'right' denomination, or the 'right' condition. Just open up and let Him in. He will put everything in order. In His providence you will be made whole. Let all this other stuff be set aside for now. Seek ye first the Kingdom of God and all else will be given unto you.

    Be well.
     
  7. webdog

    webdog
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,691
    Likes Received:
    0
    Where's your pastor and support group at Church?
     
  8. Amy.G

    Amy.G
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    XD, I don't understand the title of this thread. I don't see anything funny about slandering God's word. The NIV among other modern translations is still the word of God. If you don't like it that's fine, stick with the KJV, but don't waste anymore of your time on this silly debate. It has been shown that the NIV does NOT corrupt the scriptures, so you will do yourself a lot of good by just letting it go. It's much more important to spend your time studying God's word instead of arguing about it. :1_grouphug:
     
  9. Helen

    Helen
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/Helen2.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2001
    Messages:
    11,703
    Likes Received:
    1
    xdx, if you look at the beginning of the book of James, you will find you can ask God for wisdom and He will give it unsparingly. I suggest you prefer Him to us for your questions for at least awhile. Let Bible explain Bible and ask the Lord to open your eyes to what is actually being said.
     
  10. Amy.G

    Amy.G
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Helen is right. God gives wisdom to those who ask. I would also like to suggest that since you like to read the KJV, you might want to purchase a KJV study Bible. While study notes are not scripture they are a huge help when we have a lot questions as you do. Just something to think about.
     
  11. StefanM

    StefanM
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    Messages:
    6,429
    Likes Received:
    72
    Titus 1:2

    ho apseudes theos



    The alpha on pseudes makes it negative—like asexual reproduction = nonsexual reproduction.

    The KJV and the NIV are just trying to smooth it out. There is no textual reason to prefer “who does not lie” or “who cannot lie.”

    John 3

    Your beef is not with the NIV. It’s with the English language. English speakers do not use Thou/Thee/Thine/Thy anymore. Personally, I wish we would. IMO, it would help avoid confusion, as you see here, but the NIV remedies the solution by a footnote indicating that the “you” is plural. Your post even shows the footnote.

    Matt 9:13

    Your beef is not with the NIV per se; it’s with the underlying texts. The translators made the decision to follow the texts that do not include “to repentance.” In either case, a holistic reading of the scriptures makes it abundantly clear that Jesus desires repentance.

    Heb. 4:12

    Now you’re just being picky. You say that “piercing” = positive but “penetrating” = negative? They mean essentially the same thing. In some contexts, a difference of meaning would arise, but here the meaning is clear. You cannot fault the NIV translators for translating the term differently than the KJV. They translated from the Greek, not the KJV.

    “Living and active” sounds like much more than nothing. Quick in 1611 meant “alive, living.” Cf. the Apostle’s Creed—“to judge the quick and the dead”—he’s not coming to judge the fast, mind you. “Active” is meant in the sense of energetic (The Greek is “energes”).



    Intents vs. attitudes—it’s not an issue of thinking people are “too dumb.” They just used an alternate English word. Translation is an art, not a science. The NIV translators did not simply replace words in the KJV; they did a fresh translation. Therefore, you will come up with different words.
     
  12. Chemnitz

    Chemnitz
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    2,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    xdisciple, before you start criticizing translators for their choices why don't you take the time to learn Greek and Hebrew yourself. Until then anything you say regarding translational choices will be nothing more than blowing into the wind.
     
  13. StefanM

    StefanM
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    Messages:
    6,429
    Likes Received:
    72
    Well said, Chemnitz.
     
  14. DeeJay

    DeeJay
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    1,916
    Likes Received:
    0
    The NIV has it right here. How can you say God is ALL powerfull and then say he CANNOT do something.

    Either God is all powerfull or he Cannot lie, he can not be both.

    Like I said the NIV got it right our All Powerfull God can do what ever he wants to do. He chooses not to lie, because He is Holy.
     
  15. Claudia_T

    Claudia_T
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    May 11, 2004
    Messages:
    3,458
    Likes Received:
    0
    God CANNOT lie because "God IS Love"


    alot of verses in the KJV say something CANNOT do something:

    2Tm:2:13: If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.


    I like knowing its impossible for God to do certain things, since he is God, it is very reassuring to me.


    what are you going to do? say God decided to be Love?

    No, you know what? God IS Love.
     
    #15 Claudia_T, Dec 20, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 20, 2006
  16. Chemnitz

    Chemnitz
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    2,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    Then God is not all powerful, he is limited.
     
  17. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/Ed.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    15,715
    Likes Received:
    0
    Unfortunately your objective to show that the NIV causes
    doctrinal variations is BARKING UP THE WRONG TREE.

    Until you can find a source of doctrine using the
    NIV in the manner described, you are not showing that
    the NIV causes a variation in doctrine.

    In fact, most the great schisims since 1700, including
    the many of the 19th century (1801-1900) used
    variant understandings of the KJVs.

    Some of those schisims are:

    7th Day Adventist (SDA)
    Christian Science
    Churchs of Christ
    Latter Day Saints (especially Mormons)
    Jehovah's Witnesses

    (it wasn't until the 20th century that the KJVs
    based schisims were formed including:

    Pentacostal movement (tongues)
    Carismatic movement (gifts of the spirit)
     
  18. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/curtis.gif>

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    20,259
    Likes Received:
    4
    First of all, God is pure, and he is truth. Inability to lie is a sign of power.

    Lieing is a form of weakness, wouldn't you say ?
     
  19. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/Ed.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    15,715
    Likes Received:
    0
    Here is the funniest KJV boo-boo of all:

    2 Kings 19:35 (KJV1769):
    And it came to pass that night, that the angel of the LORD went out,
    and smote in the camp of the Assyrians
    an hundred fourscore and five thousand:
    and when they1 arose early in the morning,
    behold, they2 were all dead corpses.


    Of course, it is only funny if you
    resolve the first "they1" as "the Assyrians"
    and the second "they2" as "the Assyrians"
    so it reads:

    2 Kings 19:35 (KJV1769):
    And it came to pass that night, that the angel of the LORD went out,
    and smote in the camp of the Assyrians
    an hundred fourscore and five thousand (185,000):
    and when the Assyrians arose early in the morning,
    behold, the Assyrians were all dead corpses.

    Compare to the clarity of the HCSB = The Holman Christian Standard Bible
    2 Kings 19:35 (HCSB):

    That night the angel of the Lord went out
    and struck down 185,000 in the camp of the Assyrians.
    When the people got up the [next] morning-there
    were all the dead bodies!


    But I love to praise Jesus in 17th Century talk:
    :wavey: Praise Iesus, the Sonne of God :wavey:
     
  20. Chemnitz

    Chemnitz
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    2,485
    Likes Received:
    0
    There is a difference between not lying and the inability to lie. Not lying is a sign of God's perfection. He being all powerful could lie if he had wanted to, but he does not wish to lie so he doesn't. Whereas, to say he has an inability to lie falsifies God's confession about himself that all things are possible for him.
     

Share This Page

Loading...