The name gospel

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Benjamin, Jun 26, 2005.

  1. Benjamin

    Benjamin
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    How would you answer to some(one) that says Jesus is the Father and that is His name using this verse?

    (Isa 9:6) For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
     
  2. bmerr

    bmerr
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    Benjamin,

    bmerr here. I'd say that person sounds like they don't have a good understanding of the concept of the Trinity.

    If you would, rephrase the position in question.

    In Christ,

    bmerr
     
  3. DHK

    DHK
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    The person that says that Jesus is the Father believes in heresy. This is what the Oneness Pentecostal believe, who deny the trinity. They believe that Jesus is a manifestation of the Father, that is he takes the place of the Father, and then the Holy Spirit is Jesus Christ, or takes the place of Christ. The emphasis is always on One God, never on three persons in one God. Thus, according to them you could never have all three persons of the trinity present at any one time and still all be God. They have a problem with the baptism of Christ.
    Christ's baptism clearly shows the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit present; all at the same event.
    DHK
     
  4. Lorelei

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    Looking at the term Everlasting Father in the original languages helps us to better understand how this does not contradit the trinity. The translation of everlasting Father is Abiy in Hebrew.

    A number of proper names in the Old Testament use the term "ab" "in accordance with a custom usual in Hebrew and in Arabic, where he who possesses a thing is called the father of it." Thus "Abiethon" (2 Samuel 23:31), "father of strength," means "strong"; "Abiaseph" (Exodus 6:24), "father of gathering," means "gatherer"; "Abigail" (1 Chronicles 2:16), "father of exultation," is a woman's name meaning "exulting"; and so forth. Evidently, then, "Father of eternity" in Isaiah 9:6 means that Jesus is eternal. This would imply, of course, that He is the creator of the ages (Hebrews 1:2; 11:3), but not that He is "the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ" (2 Corinthians 1:3). The word father does not necessarily need to be translated as a "Dad." The same word was translated to mean "chief" and "prince." The term means that he is the father, or prince of eternity.
     
  5. Benjamin

    Benjamin
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    Thanks, and Yes, this was a oneness believer who set me off telling me I wasn’t saved because I wasn’t baptized in the NAME of God using many verses about the NAME of God, the blood and the water, the heresy of catholic trinity, 1 John 5:7 being added in about 400 AD by man (which is another question), on and on in a type of rehearsed war dance. My defense was the gospel by grace through faith alone and calling their baptism a work of their comic mind, but what a trip. Fortunately they were to busy trying to defend faith alone to trip me up on Isa 9:6.
     
  6. bmerr

    bmerr
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    Benjamin,

    bmerr here. I'm not very familiar with the "oneness" bunch, I'm afraid. There is alot of confusion concerning baptism and many other Biblical topics.

    I think it's helpful to understand that often the name of the Lord is a reference to His authority. Paul used the phrase "in the name of Jesus Christ" several times, indicating that he was speaking in the authority of Christ.

    For example, In Matt 28, Jesus said to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, and in Acts 2 Peter said to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. Many people see a discrepancy here, some using "Father, Son, and Holy Ghost" when they baptize, and others using only "the name of Jesus Chrst". But to do something in Jesus' name is to do it by His authority, that's all.

    By the way, very nice post, Lorelei.

    In Christ,

    bmerr
     

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