The New Testament is only about God’s elect

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by evangelist-7, Aug 18, 2013.

  1. evangelist-7

    evangelist-7
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    God is omnipresent (everywhere), omnipotent (all-powerful), omniscient (all-knowing).
    He created all angels and humans to have free will.
    And He saw everyone’s free-will decisions before the foundation of the world.

    God’s “elect” are defined here, as well as their destiny
    “For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son,
    … whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified;
    and whom He justified, these He also glorified.” (Romans 8:28-30)

    The GOSPEL was directed at God’s elect
    The elect must hear the gospel, and believe it, to get them started on their road to heaven.
    They will co-operate with God’s sanctification process, and be conformed to Christ’s image.
    Other people will “believe” the gospel also, but these people are NOT part of God’s “elect”.
    This “other” group is made up of 3 types of “believers”:
    1) who believe via blind faith … they are just born into Christianity.
    2) who believe intellectually … but they are not born-again.
    3) who believe enough to be born-again … but they reject being fully sanctified.
    (Perhaps you can make this fit into the parable of the 4 soils; I haven’t tried)
    Note: God has always taken great pride in His special and precious “remnant” of believers,
    of whom he is so proud! These believers are totally dedicated to being obedient to Him,
    which is only their reasonable service (see Rom 12:1 below).
    Christianity was never intended to be a casual walk in the park ... it sure wasn't for Jesus!


    All of the BLESSINGS are directed at God’s elect
    “To the saints who are in Ephesus, and faithful in Christ Jesus:
    … (God) who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ,
    just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world,
    that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to
    adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will
    … In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according
    to the riches of His grace … In Him also we have obtained an inheritance …” (Eph 1:1-11)
    Only God’s elect will be “faithful”, and progress to being made “holy and without blame”.

    All of the PROMISES are directed at God’s elect
    Fill in whichever passages you please … they all pertain only to God’s elect.

    All of the WARNINGS are directed at God’s elect
    These are written confirmations of what the Holy Spirit has told born-again people!
    The elect will seriously heed God’s warnings/threats … and act on them!

    • “… he who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.” (John 12:25)
    • “Do not be deceived … whatever a man sows, that he will also reap.
    For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption (eternal death),
    but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life.” (Gal 6:7-8)
    • “Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things
    the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.” (Eph 5:3-6)
    • “… to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves
    whom you obey, whether (slaves) of sin leading to death … For the end of those
    things (a life of sin) is death … For the wages of sin is death” (Rom 6:16-23)
    • “He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be
    My son. But the (sinners, all sinners) shall have their part in the lake which burns
    with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” (Rev 21:7-8)
    • “Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing
    from the living God … lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
    For we have become partakers of Christ, IF we hold the beginning of our confidence
    steadfast to the end … Do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion” (Heb 3:12-15)
    These folks who rebelled (in the OT) ... God left them scattered all over the desert floor!

    All of the ADMONITIONS are directed at God’s elect
    • “present yourselves to God … as instruments of righteousness to God” (Rom 6:13)
    • “present your members as slaves of righteousness for holiness” (Rom 6:19)
    • “present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God,
    which is your reasonable service” (Rom 12:1)
    • “let us cleanse ourselves … perfecting holiness in the fear of God.” (2 Cor 7:1)
    • “pursue … holiness, without which no one will see the Lord …” (Hebr 12:14)
    • “as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct” (1 Pet 1:15-16)
    • “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling …” (Phil 2:12)

    Christian life is supposed to start with “count the cost”
    “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
    And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish …” (John 10:27-28)
    Jesus warned to first count the cost of leaving all to follow Him!
    “If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children,
    brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple.
    And whoever does not bear his cross and come after Me cannot be My disciple.
    For which of you, intending to build a tower, does not sit down first and
    count the cost, whether he has enough to finish it … So likewise, whoever
    of you does not forsake all that he has cannot be My disciple.” (Luke 14:26-33)
    This is a hint of what the narrow and difficult road is all about.
    “Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to (eternal) life,
    and there are few who find it” (Matt 7:14)

    P.S. To direct this stuff @ anyone else is just a waste of time!

    .
     
  2. steaver

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    I see what you are trying to say, the scriptures describe them as false converts and those who just say they have faith. But authentic believers will be led by the Spirit.

    There is no such animal found within the scriptures. If one has been born of God then they will be sanctified by God, scripture is crystal clear on this point.

    1Thess5:23-24...

    "And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and [I pray God] your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful [is] he that calleth you, who also will do [it]."

    1 Cor 1:4,8...

    "I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ; Who shall also confirm you unto the end, [that ye may be] blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ."

    There is no such thing as an unsaved born again Christian, that is totally foreign to scripture. Don't know how you ever came up with that one.
     
  3. Baptist4life

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    Wow! Are you one doctrinally screwed up individual! :eek: That's all I have to say.
     
  4. evangelist-7

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    [​IMG]After some scratching, I have a warning for you!

    If Baptists, and most everyone else, throughout some centuries of history
    have totally and utterly and completely and disastrously, etc. MESSED up
    regarding Satan's doctrine of cessationism ...
    ... why is it not possible for the same re: OSAS and its' related doctrines?

    Being Baptist4life is nothing to be proud of ...
    'cause you're missing a lot of what God has for BACs who are not hung up with UNBELIEF.

    :eek: That's all I have to say.

    .
     
    #4 evangelist-7, Aug 19, 2013
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  5. evangelist-7

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    I would direct you once again to the OP ...
    and many BACs have walked (or ran) from the faith and thereby rejected it.
    Ask around ... pastors, older BACs with some experience, etc.

    .
     
    #5 evangelist-7, Aug 19, 2013
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  6. steaver

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    Negative, and I would direct you to the two scripture references I posted.

    If anyone ran from Christ then as John said, "They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would [no doubt] have continued with us: but [they went out], that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."

    No such thing as a Born Again Christian not being confirmed sanctified unto the end. Scripture is solid on this point.
     
  7. evangelist-7

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    I would direct you to the OP :sleep: because you still don't get it.

    Your passage above simply describes 2 types of church-goers who may have left:
    (1) some unsaved ... not of us (believers)
    (2) some BACs ... not of us (elect)

    Although the chances favor (1) because it's not likely that several BACs would fall away @ the same time.

    .
     
    #7 evangelist-7, Aug 19, 2013
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  8. DHK

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    I didn't read the OP. It's too long; too many colors and not enough spaces.

    But I did read the title of this thread:
    The New Testament is only about God’s elect

    --and that isn't true.

    Here is what the Bible says about one individual:
    Acts 13:10 And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, thou child of the devil, thou enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord?
    11 And now, behold, the hand of the Lord is upon thee, and thou shalt be blind, not seeing the sun for a season. And immediately there fell on him a mist and a darkness; and he went about seeking some to lead him by the hand.

    Do you think he was one of God's elect?
    But the NT does speak "about" him.
     
  9. steaver

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    Well, let's take your #2 and see if it will coincide with scripture, for it is the scriptures which must interpret the scriptures for us and not any pet premises.

    Let us read....

    1 Cor 1:4,8...
    "I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ; Who shall also confirm you unto the end, [that ye may be] blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ."

    "...the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ". That would make one a born-again Christian.

    "...Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ". That would make all the born-again Christians an eternal elect.

    And then we have several other passages which leave no doubt and no wiggle room out of this declaration by God, one which comes to mind...

    1Peter1:2,3,5...
    Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.....Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time".

    How could I add anything to such a perfectly clear declaration by God?? As Paul said, "not of yourselves"

    There is no such thing as an unsaved born again Christian, that is totally foreign to scripture. Don't know how you ever came up with that one.
     
  10. DrJamesAch

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  11. evangelist-7

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    Yes, I knew that title wasn't accurate enough!
    Please don't take things so literally.
    The NT talks a lot about Satan, and he's not one of God's elect.
    etc.

    .
     
  12. evangelist-7

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    Sorry, I don't know if you're joking! However ...

    Please only rely on Scripture and the Holy Spirit (which are always in agreement).
    Please do not rely on man's ideas, opinions, doctrines, etc.

    As for mine, I'm just trying to open peoples' minds to spiritual truth,
    so when you read it in Scripture or hear it from God's Spirit, it won't be completely foreign to you.
    I.E. Hopefully, you won't reject it immediately as if it was some crazy thought in your head.

    But, whatever you do, please don't tell us that you have a doctorate from some Seminary!

    .
     
    #12 evangelist-7, Aug 20, 2013
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  13. evangelist-7

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    I would direct you to the OP :sleep: because you still don't get it.
    And your credibility around here is dwindling fast indeed.

    Hint: you have to be able to read OPs and understand what is written therein!
    Thou does not have to agree with anyone's OP ... just understand it.

    Re: Elect ... at least you can underline nicely!

    Dr. Evangelist hereby recommends (after exhaustive analysis)
    that Steaver be given a lobotomy post haste, if not sooner.

    .
     
    #13 evangelist-7, Aug 20, 2013
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  14. steaver

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    Well, you did have a choice, you could have prayed and asked the Father to reveal to you what the Holy Spirit has said in the two passages I posted, and then yield to the Spirit's teaching that there is no such thing as a saved person not reaching total sanctification through Christ, as the Word and Spirit says....

    or....as you chose....you could just make some babe in Christ type remarks, continuing to ignore the Spirit. (Sorry, I have been at this too long to be baited into immature remarks, there is scripture, I'm pretty sure you must have come across it in your studies, which instructs us how to answer people, even if we may be in disagreement with them)

    All I can do is preach the word so hopefully others will not be led astray by strange doctrines.

    But I have some encouraging words for you! Despite your errors in doctrine, you will be saved! If so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.

    "According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

    For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

    Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

    Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

    If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

    If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire."

    1Cor3:10-15

    ps, the underlining of words or phrases is meant to emphasize the debate point being presented, bolding or changing color or font size will also have the same effect. Of course, if a person is cemented in their beliefs it will be of no effect at all. The Lord says "come, let us reason together". I don't think you are looking for any of that. Seems you are pretty stuck on your personal, and I believe solitary, interpretations.
     
  15. evangelist-7

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    ---------------------------------------------------- :sleep: --- :sleeping_2:


    Some of the warning passages about losing eternal life
    (which you have read)
    actually even include the exact words "eternal life!

    There is no such thing as a member of the elect (Rom 8:28-30) not reaching total sanctification through Christ!

    But, not all BACs are members of the elect ... as is made abundantly clear in the many warnings to the churches!

    P.S. I write this not to Steaver, but to other members who may benefit from it.

    .
     
    #15 evangelist-7, Aug 21, 2013
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  16. Yeshua1

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    His bigger problem in this is that he holds that there are elect saved who have the Spirit, and also unsaved who also have the Spirit! as he holds that just real saved elect keep saved and keep the Spirit, while unelect saved forfeit salvation and lose the Spirit!
     
  17. DHK

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    How can an unsaved person have the Spirit of God.

    Jesus said that the Pharisees had A spirit, but it wasn't the Holy Spirit!
     
  18. Yeshua1

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    I know! he holds that both elect and unelect saved sinners get the Spirit from God, and those saved who are not elect will lose their salvation and forfeit the Spirit!

    LOVE to see the scripture supporting that!
     
    #18 Yeshua1, Aug 22, 2013
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  19. evangelist-7

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    'Tis called falling from (or rejecting) grace! ... which Paul mentions at least twice.

    Hint #1: It's surprising what a person can learn by studying the NT,
    if he has an open heart and mind, and has no bias!

    Hint #2: The Holy Spirit will not try very hard to teach one who does not meet that criteria!

    .
     
  20. DHK

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    Why don't you quote this verse in its context. Give the reference. Copy and paste the complete verse along with the one before and after.
    It is my contention that you don't really know what the verse means. No doubt you ignore context.
     

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