The Restrainer of 2 Thessalonians

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by antiaging, Jan 11, 2009.

  1. antiaging

    antiaging
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    The restrainer from the context of the verses, is that the apostacy or falling away from the faith must happen before antichrist is revealed. The he who now restrains (at the time of the writing) is referring to the christians that have not fallen away from the faith yet {taken out of the way}. [NOTE: The apostacy has happened now, and the restrainer is no longer here. The antichrist may be revealed now.]
    Let's look at it:

    2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for [that day shall not come], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

    2 Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
    2 Thessalonians 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
    2 Thessalonians 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
    2 Thessalonians 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
    2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
    [letteth means restrains in middle english; KJV english]

    2 Thess. 2:6 is the key. He says "and now ye know what withholdeth". You know because he just told you in 2 Thes. 2:3, that the apostacy (or falling away from the true faith) must happen first. It was withholding the antichrist from being revealed because it had not happened yet.
    Since it is referring to the apostacy must happen first, and the fact that it had not happened yet was restraining the antichrist from being revealed, So 2 Thess. 2:7 means, he (anyone) that is not yet fallen away from the faith, will restrain, until he falls away from the faith and is taken out of the way. Then antichrist may be revealed.
    The falling away from the true Christian faith has been happening for the past few decades. The antichrist system has flooded the market with fake bibles with the words changed, and infiltrated the protestant pulpits with false preachers preaching the love gospel;- they emphasize love and unity and only rarely preach repentance and sound doctrine. Repentance is one of the requirements for salvation.
    The watered down version of Christianity, which is a falling away from the true faith is now preached mostly. Television and movies, (controlled by the antichrist system, has destroyed the moral values of the youth, and young adults, and some older adults. Immoral people fill the seats in the chuches; not really saved and unrepentant. Even homosexual churches abound. Antichrist system fake preachers faking healing miracles on TV, also.
    So now the antichrist may be revealed because the apostacy has happened.
    John Calvin
    (1509-1564) (Presbyterian)
    "Some persons think us too severe and censorious when we call the Roman pontiff Antichrist. But those who are of this opinion do not consider that they bring the same charge of presumption against Paul himself, after whom we speak and whose language we adopt...I shall briefly show that (Paul's words in II Thess. 2) are not capable of any other interpretation than that which applies them to the Papacy." Taken from "Institutes" by John Calvin.

    Martin Luther
    (1483-1546) (Lutheran)
    "We here are of the conviction that the papacy is the seat of the true and real Antichrist...personally I declare that I owe the Pope no other obedience than that to Antichrist." (Aug. 18, 1520)

    John Knox
    (1505-1572) (Scotch Presbyterian)
    Knox wrote to abolish "that tyranny which the pope himself has for so many ages exercised over the church" and that the pope should be recognized as "the very antichrist, and son of perdition, of whom Paul speaks." Taken from "The Zurich Letters" pg. 199 by John Knox.

    Cotton Mather
    (1663-1728) (Congregational Theologian)
    "The oracles of God foretold the rising of an Antichrist in the Christian Church; and in the Pope of Rome, all the characteristics of that Antichrist are so marvelously answered that if any who read the Scriptures do not see it, there is a marvelous blindness upon them." Taken from "The Fall of Babylon" by Cotton Mather

    Thomas Cranmer
    (1489-1556) (Anglican)
    "Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons." (Referring to prophecies in Revelation and Daniel.) Taken from "Works" by Cranmer, Vol. 1, pp. 6-7.

    John Wesley
    (1703-1791) (Methodist)
    Speaking of the Papacy he said, "He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers...He it is...that exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped...claiming the highest power, and highest honor...claiming the prerogatives which belong to God alone." Taken from "Antichrist and His Ten Kingdoms" by John Wesley, pg. 110.

    Roger William
    (1603-1683) (First Baptist Pastor in America)
    He called the Pope "the pretended Vicar of Christ on earth, who sits as God over the Temple of God, exalting himself not only above all that is called God, but over the souls and consciences of all his vessals, yea over the Spirit of Christ, over the Holy Spirit, yea, and God himself...speaking against the God of heaven, thinking to changed times and laws: but he is the son of perdition (II Thess. 2)."

    You can add to those names these men that believed the same sort of thing.
    Wycliff, Tyndale, Sir Isaac Newton, Fox, Finney, Moody, Spurgeon.

    See the book, THE PROPHETIC FAITH OF OUR FATHERS, by Froom for further information on this subject. --or GREAT PROPHECIES OF THE BIBLE by Woodrow.

    antichrist = last pope {first beast of revelation 13}
    false prophet, second beast of revelation 13 = last jesuit general
    The jesuit general has a large number of workers that take orders from him worldwide which have infiltrated the newsmedia, churches, government, entertainment industry, big business, law enforcement, according to authors like avro manhattan, former jesuits, Alberto Rivera, and malachi martin, and Jack Chick, and the author of the website about the Jesuit general,
    vaticanassassins.org, --click on Kolvenbach. See online book, smokescreens.
    Revelation 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
    Revelation 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

    The number of the name of the man the antichrist must add up to 666. The new testament was written in Greek, and greek letters are used for numbers. Martin Luther showed during the reformation that the name Benedict [which is Benediktos in Greek] adds up to 666 when numbers are substituted for letters. Martin Luther thought it might refer to a pope named Benedict.


    Β
    ε
    ν
    ε
    δ
    ι
    κ
    τ
    ο
    σς
    TOTAL
    2
    5
    50
    5
    4
    10
    20
    300
    70
    200
    total = 666

    The pope now is Benedict xvi.
     
    #1 antiaging, Jan 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2009
  2. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    I certainly have more questions in my mind than answers concerning the unfolding of the last days and the culmination of this present evil world. One question that comes to mind is the following. Does the anti Christ have to be a pope, or simply one aligned with that system of religious/governmental power?
     
  3. Marcia

    Marcia
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    "He who restrains" is the Holy Spirit.
     
  4. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    How can that be Marcia? Can you tell us how you arrived at your conclusion?
     
  5. Marcia

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    If you look at that passage and verse:
    For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way

    It seems to me only the Holy Spirit could restrain iniquity. Men cannot suppress or restrain sin.

    I am a pretrib person and believe that this means when the church will be raptured. The Holy Spirit will be "taken out of the way" of sin through believers being removed. This does not mean the Holy Spirit is gone because He is omnipresent. However, the Holy Spirit as an indweller of believers will be gone. Can you imagine earth with no believers?

    The HS will not be at work in believers for good works, kindness, returning good for evil, etc. Even though Christians do not meet this ideal, to have all believers gone will have an effect on sin, because the power of the HS in the lives of these people will be gone.

    I do believe that then some will be saved during the Tribulation, and martyred. This is in Revelation.

    I don't want to get into a debate at all, just stating my views.
     
  6. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: :smilewinkgrin: You are on the wrong forum to simply do that. :)
     
  7. rbell

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    Numerology is pagan, and has no place in scriptural interpretation.
     
  8. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: I am staring at it with double bifocals ( in a figurative sense I might add :))and still cannot see the rapture even faintly being alluded to, nor do I see a reference or indication of ‘restraining iniquity’ except possibly in some very limited sense. It simply speaks of someone or something that prohibits the man of sin from being revealed until the appointed time. Maybe he was being restained due to his birth not yet occurring, or simply be the work of a political system or ruler(s) of that system, could it not? To me it simply sets forth an obstacle of some kind that prohibits for a time his revealing.
     
  9. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: I agree that there must be a falling away first, but I cannot believe that he who now restrains is referring to Christians period. Sorry.

    I certainly agree with you that repentance is a condition of salvation. :thumbs: ( I believe it was you that made that comment)
     
  10. Marcia

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    This post got messed up. See next one. Sorry.
     
    #10 Marcia, Jan 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2009
  11. Marcia

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    True, but I've already been posting in the Baptist forums, and I think there's a thread or two here, on several threads on Dispensationalism, the Restrainer, when Jesus comes back, the MK, etc., mostly attacks on Dispensationalism.

    I'm just tired of the attacks.
     
  12. Marcia

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    I don't get the rapture just from this, but from other passages.

    Keep in mind it says "he who restrains" will be taken out of the way. This is personal, not impersonal.

    For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way.
     
  13. Marcia

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    I agree. The passage does not say his name adds up to six-hundred and sixty-six. Anyway, it's impossible to make a name add up to six-hundred and sixty-six. I used to do some numerology.
     
  14. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: Here is a thought I read that might be good to consider. I read something to the effect in a reputable commentary that sometime words such as ‘he,’ ‘king’ or other singular notations can in fact be referring to more than one in some places. ‘The king’ might in some cases be referring to several kings acting in concert, etc. They gave a list of the verses that would indicate it but I do not have it before me now.

    In common parlance in certain we might find many such illustrations of the usage of individual pronouns being used to depict effort by more than one individual or things. Possible?
     
  15. Marcia

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    No, I don't think so. This passage has nothing to do with kings or what you are talking about.

    Why not just take it for what it says? "He who now restrains?"
     
  16. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: Could the ‘he’ be a ruler that is in charge of a system of government such as say the Roman Empire? If not, why not? I believe it was Adam Clarke that claimed that most of the early Christian fathers felt that to be the case.
     
  17. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    If I said that President Bush ‘he’ passed a law, could in fact I be referring to a law passed by all of congress as well as himself? Could the ‘he’ be referring to more than one entity in all actuality?
     
  18. Marcia

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    I still think it's the Holy Spirit. The others you suggest don't make sense to me, but I'm sure they do to you.

    We are not going to resolve this here.

    Also, it says "he who now restrains," so it can't be someone who is dead or a future person since at the time this was written, it is not a future person (he who now restrains). There's only One who restrained then and now - the Holy Spirit.
     
  19. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    Take President Bush for example. He has been blamed for anything and everything. The truth is that many things that are actually the work of others in the administration, the president still gets blamed for it. In common parlance we can still refer to ‘he’ or ‘him’ as responsible for things that in essence were in actuality nothing more than the combined works of his subordinates.

    Adam Clarke in his notes on 2Thes. sites Dan 7:8, Rev. 17 both using the word ‘king’ to in reality be speaking of a succession of kings or more than one man.

    I could say, 'He' is restraining Obama from taking office at this moment. Could I be speaking of our government as headed up by one man in my comment, therefore in reality the 'he' be referring to our government as a whole, including our Consitution?
     
  20. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: Says who? Is there a verse or evidence to support that position? Parents, the law, and our soldiers restrain evil every day. I could say that 'he, referring to our Pesident as the leader of our Armed Forces, restrains the evil, when in fact I am speaking of the President, his cabinet, Congress and our great men and women in uniform as being incorporated in the 'he.' That is when a women becomes a 'he.':wavey:
     
    #20 Heavenly Pilgrim, Jan 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2009

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