The Resurrection Body and 1st Cor. 15 (But don't forget 12, 13, and 14)

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by asterisktom, Dec 21, 2011.

  1. asterisktom

    asterisktom
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    The Resurrection Body and 1st Cor. 15.
    But don't forget 12, 13, and 14

    One thing I noticed in studying out 1st Corinthians and the resurrection body is that this seems to be a sustained theme in this epistle, the last part at least. People miss the whole picture who just focus on that 15th chapter.

    Of course, as a Preterist, I have a different view on what the resurrection body is than many here, I realize. I believe that the emphasis in chapter 15 is much more on a corporate vs. a bodily (individual) resurrection. With that emphasis in mind I began to notice the wider context. Interesting facts came to light.

    Starting with the word "body"
    Number one fact is that there is not one single reference to "bodies" in the plural in reference to the resurrection. This is an important detail. One does a Google search for the phrase "bodily resurrection" "resurrection bodies", "glorified bodies", etc. and one will get many hits, many pointing to the very chapter under consideration. But if you do a Bible search for those terms - or terms truly comparable - you come up with nothing.

    The chapters of 1 Cor.12 through 15 have much to say about the term "body". I believe a study of these can be very fruitful. Take a look at some preliminary details:

    Chapters 12 - 15 have 22 references to the word "body".
    Chapters 12 - 15 have only 2 references to "bodies", 15:40 - in a reference to astronomical objects.

    Here is the breakdown, with the textually significant verses in bold:
    12:12 (twice); 13; 14; 15 (twice); 16 (twice); 17; 18; 19; 20; 22; 23; 24; 25; 27. 16 references to "body" in this chapter
    13:3 starts with a reference to an individual body, Paul's. The only reference in the chapter to "body".
    14:1 - 15:9 has no references to "body", but has 10 references to "the church". I believe that this is synonymous, reflecting a partial shift in Paul's subject from the unity of the church in 12 to the usefulness (or uses) of the church in the present passage. Though the emphasis shifted it is still the same subject; the church as the body of Christ.
    15:38 and 40 gives two body examples from creation, their being distinguished in nature and in glory.

    Now we come to the "body" verses in the context of the resurrection.
    15:42, 44 (four times).

    I want to go into greater detail on these verses later, but first I wanted to draw attention to the context that these verses need to be seen in. It is noteworthy that these last few verses are all so often called upon and drawn out and exposited - to the exclusion of that necessary background. When you study the whole - Don't take my word for it. Do it yourself - you notice that Paul really, really is stressing the unity of the body, and that it is - that we are - one on Christ. But we are of such an individualistic bent that we have a hard time seeing this.
    ---
    There are a few things I wanted to add to my original post. Taking a broader look at these chapters it can be seen that Paul, though he leaves off referring to "body" in chapters 13 and 14 (with one off-topic exception of 13:3) he now refers to "church", using one as synonymously for the other. The body is the church:

    12:18: "God has set the members ... in the body."
    12:24: "God composed the body"

    compared to verses like...
    12:28: "God has appointed these in the church."

    12:4 - 12 expounds on the gifts to benefit the the body, and
    12:28; 14:12, 26 the gifts to the church.

    My OP was never about our not getting our individual rewards, or that we will just blend into some cosmic spiritual oversoul. We will always be individuals. And we will always (as the Confession says) "enjoy Him forever". But we will be spiritual beings, not flesh and blood. As Paul says, that would be an impossibility. God is Spirit. We worship in spirit and in truth. We fellowship and commune the same way.

    We are so attuned to the physicality of this life, and are so acculturated to traditional and engrained thinking, that we have a hard time even thing about not being physical. We appraise the reward of a spiritual God by flesh-and-blood standards.

    Once again: my point in the OP was that physical bodies in the resurrection is not what Paul was writing of in these chapters. His main thrust was on the body of Christ, and that we are members of that one body. He says this several times.

    As time permits I want to write some more on this last half of 1 Cor. 15, starting with verse 35.
     
    #1 asterisktom, Dec 21, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 21, 2011
  2. percho

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    Resurrection and body singular either.

    "Resurrection" AND "Body"
    occurs in 0 verses in the KJV (see Primary Results).
    Here are some additional combinations of your search terms.
     
  3. JesusFan

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    The FATAL flaw to your understanding here is that Jesus Himself was resurrected as a Physical being, bodily form, in fact SAME Body as he was killed off in on the cross, given resurrected life via the Holy Spirit bring Him up in His old.new Body!

    He caould eat fish, even said that he was flesh and blood, had the wounds/scars still, "not a spirit"

    His body the template for ours, as John says, when wwe see Him, we shall become as he now is, glorified physical bodies!
     
  4. asterisktom

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    The fatal flaw here is your not really knowing what I believe. Do you think that I teach Christ not being resurrected in a physical body?
     
  5. convicted1

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    Serious question for you Brother Tom. Do you believe when we die, that our bodies will be raised from the grave?
     
  6. JesusFan

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    Does he still have that same body, and do we experience a physical or a spiritual resurrection?
     
  7. asterisktom

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    I appreciate serious, respectful questions. If by "bodies" you mean "physical bodies", then, the answer would be "No". We will "ever be with the Lord".

    If the perfect God, the everlasting Trinity, had existed forever in spiritual (not physical) form why should it seem a bad thing, likewise, not to have physical bodies?
     
  8. asterisktom

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    No, He does not have the same body. He will once again have - just as He prayed - the glory that he had before with the Father.

    Christ was raised in a physical body. But He did not come back in physical body. There was no need for Him to have returned in a physical body, like there was a need for Him to have suffered in a physical body.

    Likewise, there is no need for us to have physical bodies. Neither is there any passage that teaches that. If God has from eternity past until the Incarnation existed purely as spirit, and the Father and Holy Spirit are still entirely spirit (though Preterists would say Christ is too) why do some view it as cultic or gnostic for us to be the same way?

    If the Trinity, eternally self-communicating and self-loving (as John Owen writes in his Christologia) was already perfect how can this perfection be "improved" by a change of essence of one of them? How can perfection be improved? If there is room for improvement that implies that what God was before was not perfect.
     
    #8 asterisktom, Dec 22, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 22, 2011
  9. JesusFan

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    jesus will be the same forever, humanity and God in ONE being...

    he forever has those scars/woundings, and he will be a man still when we see Him face to face!

    That is the Incarnation, God FOREVER taking on Humanity and nbeing found in human body/form!
     
  10. freeatlast

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    Forgive me as I am a little slow. What exactly are you trying to make a point of?
     
  11. JesusFan

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    No literal second Coming, no bodily resurrection, basically saints die and live forever in a "spiritual form" whatever that might be!
     
  12. freeatlast

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    Thank you for the information. Now I would like to have the OP poster to acknowledge or deny this.
     
  13. asterisktom

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    You are OK with Christ being scarred forever with man's marks? Wow. So then those who were likewise scarred for their faith - maimed, flayed, decapitated, burned beyond recognition - they do not have those scars. But Jesus keeps His.
    Why?
    And more to the point - where is this in the Bible?

    And neither do you have any proof that "jesus will be the same forever, humanity and God in ONE being..."
     
  14. JesusFan

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    jesus in the Incarnation merged/fused/became God-man ...

    EVERY true Christian theology affirms that He is forever the God-man, to denyt that would be heresey!
     
  15. asterisktom

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    A bodily resurrection of Christ, but there is no need for a bodily (as in flesh and blood) resurrection for saints. That is the point of the article. Folks, it is all in the Bible. That is why I did the careful study. So far there has been almost no comments on the verses mentioned, and on the points raised from those verses.
     
  16. freeatlast

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    I can tell you for me it is because I am not sure what you are trying to get at. What exactly is your point?
     
  17. JesusFan

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    God will fully redeem us when we receive our glorified bodies, our physical ones born in died, buried, but when we return with jesus, will be reunited and glorified, SAME flash and blood glorified body he now has!
     
  18. asterisktom

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    OK ... whatever.

    Who needs an open Bible when we can just open our mouth and spout whatever comes to mind?
     
    #18 asterisktom, Dec 22, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 22, 2011
  19. JesusFan

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    Do you know ANY reputable Christian theologian who ever denied jesus is now still eternal God/man in One Body, same one that he was raised up to heaven in?
     
  20. asterisktom

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    One of my points is that there is no mention of our getting physical bodies in I cor. 15. In the entire section (chapters 12-15, roughly) the emphasis is on the one Body of Christ, of which we are members.

    The 15th chapter needs to be understood in the light of the building context of the previous chapters.
     

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