I have come to the conclusion that many of the words of calvinists are right but they are unable to translate that to American society and its way of thinking in such a way that Americans can understand God the way the Jews did. It seems that calvinists tend to treat passages from a modern day Greek/American understanding rather than from the historical Jewish understanding. That was clearly demonstrated awhile back someone posted about God creating evil. A number of calvinists posted that God could not possibly create evil. From a Jewish historical context God did create evil but a number failed to see that from the historical Jewish mindset for whom those passages were written to. Rather they saw God creating good and evil as a dichotomy and impossible to understand. Yet scripture teaches that God did create good and evil. It is not an either/or situation but both. I believe the same trouble is in both camps among calvinists and arminianists.