The way of the master

Discussion in 'Missions / Witnessing / eVangelism' started by El_Guero, Jan 21, 2007.

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How has the way of the master affected your witnessing?

  1. I have seen no one come to Christ.

    4.0%
  2. I have seen 1 - 3 come to Christ.

    8.0%
  3. I have seen 4 - 10 come to Christ.

    4.0%
  4. I have seen more than 10 come to Christ.

    16.0%
  5. I used other methods with WOM.

    28.0%
  6. I have not used WOM.

    60.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. El_Guero

    El_Guero
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    The way of the master has a lot of publicity and a lot of supporters.

    But, I have yet to meet any ONE that was led to Christ by this method.

    Since, there seem to be some that practice the way of the master on this board, I was wondering how many of you have led someone to Christ using the way of the master?
     
  2. bapmom

    bapmom
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    while not having learned it from "Way of the Master", I have led people to the Lord through pointing out the fact of their sinfulness. Isn't that basically what WotM is?

    Of course, the Holy Spirit is the One doing the convicting of sin in their hearts, and there have been several times when the person I was talking to was just waiting for someone to show them the way.

    I do know a couple of men in my church who have learned something from WotM that they incorporated into their soulwinning efforts. Not sure if this fits with your question though.
     
  3. JamieinNH

    JamieinNH
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    I have used the Way of the Master teachings, but I couldn't tell you how many were saved. You don't always see people being saved in front of you. It happens from within, somtimes overnight, sometimes after a period of time.

    Most of the people I have dealt with, with this method are strangers or people I don't know very well, so I don't always tracked them down to see if they have converted.

    I am sure the Lord is working with the Way of the Master or any good teachings to pull people to Christ.

    Jamie
     
  4. bapmom

    bapmom
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    This is one weakness Ive seen with WotM.....that they don't always "draw the net" very clearly, or at least they don't show it being drawn in. In the tapes Ive seen they do a good job of presenting our sinful state to people, and proving to them that there is sin in their life, but then they don't really show the witnesser what to do next. IMO, we need to ask people if they want to make a decision right then. Of course, with the Holy Spirit guiding, but just showing aperson that they are sinning and need a Saviour is not always enough. They need to know that there is a decision to be made and God is calling on them to make that decision.

    Perhaps there needs to be some teaching on the follow-ups, as well.
     
  5. tinytim

    tinytim
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    I use it along with the Roman's Road...

    And I agree with Bapmom... That is why I use Roman's Road along with it.
    It has been very effective... especially with teens and twenty-somethings.

    I have also tried 'Share Jesus without fear" But am not as comfortable with it.
     
  6. El_Guero

    El_Guero
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    This is the problem that I have seen in those that evangelize for the WOM method of evangelism.

    While I have seen significant numbers of conversions among those using Evangelism Explosion, I have not seen that among those that use WOM. Instead, I have seen those using WOM enjoying the response of the lost person when they recognize their sinful state . . . and then the 'saved' person does not relate that he or she was just as lost as the person that they are 'arguing' towards the Kingdom.

    Personally? I think that EE is difficult and long, but it works well. WOM is much shorter and easier to learn, but it does not seem to produce the results that EE does . . .

    WHEW! EE is WORK! But, every soul that comes to Christ is worth the work . . .

    Amen?

    Amen!

    PS - great post!

     
  7. Brian30755

    Brian30755
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    I have seen significant numbers of conversions at Billy Graham crusades on TV. Thousands at a time.

    I've also read where Billy Graham was asked in an interview, "What are you thinking when all those people are coming forward?" His response: "I'm thinking that only one in four is serious".

    I've seen significant numbers of people go forward during an altar call at church and "ask Jesus into their heart". Three weeks later, they're nowhere to be found. They were talked into giving this Jesus thing a try with the promises of peace, joy, love, happiness, etc. Then they discovered that they still had all the problems they had before, so now when someone tries to witness to them, their response is "Nah, I already tried that once. It didn't work for me."

    Is it more important to see "significant numbers" of conversions, or is it more important to see "genuine" conversions?

    The only reason you might see a true Christian "enjoying" the response of the lost person when they recognize their sinful state is because they know that it's ONLY when a person truly recognizes and believes that they have a disease that they are then ready and willing to receive the cure.

    You say "the saved person does not relate that he or she was just as lost as the person that they are 'arguing' toward the Kingdom."

    You can call using God's law as it was intended "arguing" if you want to, but that's not what it is.

    I've seen probably every episode of "Way of the Master" and watched all their "on the street" interviews.....and never once have I seen the "saved" person deny that they were just as lost as the person they are talking to. In fact, I've seen several interviews where, when asked if they were guilty of a certain sin, the person would say to the saved person "Yes, but so are you", and the "saved" person would say "Yes, I am guilty of it, too."

    If you want to see a Baptist preacher doing exactly what I'm talking about, watch the video at www.whatstandard.com

    What are the results you are after? I could go around asking everyone I meet every day, "When you die, do you want to go to Heaven or to Hell". When they say "Heaven", I could say "Just say this prayer, and you'll go to Heaven". Would it get results? Absolutely. But would the people be genuinely saved?

    If EE is working for you, then that's fantastic! Keep using it, Brother.

    But I believe The Way of the Master has been responsible for getting thousands of Christians "fired up" about sharing their faith.....people who were never talking to anyone about Jesus. For this I am truly thankful.

    Also, the "method" taught by The Way of the Master is Biblically sound. If it wasn't, I wouldn't be defending it.
     
  8. El_Guero

    El_Guero
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    Brother,

    I place my faith upon Jesus Christ. It is the Gospel message that saves. It is sad that people teach that we should have faith in programs (WOTM versus EE).

    If your tool helps you communicate the Gospel, and your tool allows God to move through through you and bring people into His Kingdom - so be it.

    But, I have never seen God move through people as they used WOTM. Great movies. Great stories. But. I have never seen it work.
     
  9. Mike McK

    Mike McK
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    I agree. I listen to the show daily and have never heard Todd, Trish, Lawman, or Aaron share the Gospel with anything but the utmost humility.

    Every now and then, Trish will get a little over-excited, but that's much more comical than it is prideful.

    I'm one of them.

    I've been a Christian for going on twenty years now. I was one of the "just say this prayer after me" crowd and it was a disaster. I watched so many people respond to the Gospel out of some emotional surge or intellectual assent, but never really surrendering themselves to Christ. Sure enough, after the novelty wore off, they fell away. Dropped out of church, had no desire to live for the Lord. More or less right back where they started.

    When I first heard about WoTM, I used to mock it. I used to mock Kirk Cameron ("The poor man's Jason Bateman", I would call him). Turns out, I'm the one with egg on my face because that cat really does know what he's talking about. Not a great preacher, but definitely is Biblically sound and has no trouble laying it out there.

    After I started to listen to that show, I noticed that my own life changed. I started to become very discerning about what I allowed into my home and how I behaved, really becoming concerned with every aspect of my life being pleasing to God.

    In addition, my attitude toward sharing the Gospel started to change and I went from seeing false converts by the score to more and more people living for the Lord and actually becoming disciples.

    We've adopted many of their evangelism attitudes into our church and, since last April, we've grown from 22 to 90. That's not just pew warmers, either.

    So you bet I'll speak up for WoTM.
     
  10. El_Guero

    El_Guero
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    Tiny

    Besides you there do not seem to be any users of the WOTM that are actually leading people to Christ.

    So, I will ask the only one so fat that has used the WOTM for the Glory of God and the Kingdom:

    Do you find that WOTM works with adults?

    Do you think that it is a valuable tool in your witnessing tool kit?

    If you had to give up using the WOTM, could you effectively witness without it?
     
  11. JamieinNH

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    Read post #3

    I know you asked Tim for his answer, but I thought I would respond as well.

    No one really knows what changed a person's heart, other than to say God did. If life, at least in my life, you can witness to people all the time, but not know the out come. There are some that you will see the changes, and see them coming to church and getting involved and you will know you helped them along the way, but there are MANY people I witness to, that I never see the results, but know that God has touched their life and in time they will come to Christ.

    Listen to this 10 minute true story about a man live on George Street and how he witnessed to people. but never knew the results until 40 years later and you will understand what I am talking about.

    Yes, I do.

    Yes, of course. It's only one of many tools I use in witnessing.

    Jamie
     
  12. IronWill

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    Results don't mean much with "evangalism" methods. WotM is good material, and isn't shallow in it's approach. It definitely plants a seed, and sometimes you see a "result." But I don't place much stock in results when it comes to evangalism.


    One sows the seed, one waters, and God gives the increase.
     
  13. Christlifter

    Christlifter
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    Wotm

    You gotta get lost, before you can get saved!
    You (Really the Holy Ghost) gotta get THEM lost, before they can get saved!

    It's not the actual techniques of WOTM that matter, from what I have learned. It's the pure teaching of using The Law to help assist in generating conviction, or at least to open the persons eyes to further inclination towards truth, if so desired. Seeing your lost estate is the first step in Biblical Conversion. I have also learned from Fundamental and Calvinist Baptists that the Holy Ghost must be in it, creating Conviction, to lead them to Repentance.

    Also, sometimes WOTM doesnt not focus enough on the Gospel, Christ, or Faith/Trust/Believe. they are also WAY TOO COZY with the Charismaniacs for my "Comfort". (Calvary Chapel, TBN, etc.)

    So foundationally I open in prayer (letting God and them know I am just a vessel, and can't save anyone) and use WOTM when begining to talk to someone. Usually it only takes 30 sec. to about 10 minutes.

    If they are Holy Ghost convinced based on their conscience (law on heart), that they have violated it, and have broken the Law of God (10 Commandments), and desire to repent from their own way, and sinfulness, and turn from false trusts (including past professions and "experiences"),

    I then present the Gospel of Christ Jesus: Shed Blood, Death, Burial, Resurrection, He is God, not a sinner. I then have them personally apply it to themselves in the context of the verses I show them.

    Then I speak about Repentance and Faith. Repentance without Holy Ghost conviction is works. Faith without Conviction/Repentance is head-knowledge/mental assent. Repentance and Faith are Heart Attitudes, not works. But you gotta know your lost, before you can get saved. (I was saved out of Charismania, so I know about emotionalism. Too many folks in Baptist churches have these 2 imbalances going on.)

    Then I ask them if they feel pressured about salvation, by me or anyone else. If not, I ask them if they have any questions. then after (if any) misconceptions are fixed, I close in prayer, letting God and them know I am just a vessel, and can't save anyone.

    While praying, (eyes closed) I tell them that if they are convicted of their sin, know they are going to Hell, Desire to repent, and trust Christ as their Saviour, to take my hand. If they do, I ask them in their own words to express that to God on their own. So far, in being this thourough I have seen 3 people saved in the last 3 months. Praise God, and Glory to Him, they are sticking!

    When Witnessing this way I use WOTM Law and Conscience--- (Exodus 20, Rom 2:14-18) After they assent to being a sinner and conscience violator/law breaker I go to: Hell/Lake of Fire/Second Death----(Revelation 20-21) after assent to God justly throwing them in Hell I go to: Romans Road/Sin and Salvation (Free Gift vs. Wages)----- (3:10-11, 3:23, 5:8-10, 6:23, 10:9-13) after assent to Eternal Life being a free Gift, and cannot be earned, and assenting to Christ dying for their sins and suffering in their place I go to: Repentance/Faith/Eternal Life---- John 3:16-21 After assenting to desire to turn from sin, and trust Christ as their Saviour I go to: Heart of Truth (sincerity)---- Luke 15 (Pharisee/Publican)"God be merciful to me, a sinner!"

    If they get hung up on any part of this, I renforce God's Word on whatever part, and leave the Holy Ghost to bring it back up later.


    This compliation of evangelism ideas came from the following sources of Baptist - Calvinists and Non-Calvinists - Plymouth Brethern, Dutch Reformed, Moody Church guys, TRULEY BORN AGAIN Arminianists (Salvation "losers"), and Men of God whos writings are preserved in the Internet and books.

    Pastor Paul Chappell (Lancaster Baptist Church), Biblical Councelor Jim Binney, Pastor Michael Rodgers (Faith Baptist Tabernacle), Pastor Robert Jordan (Fort Hope Baptist Church), Dr. John R. Rice -Late, Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron, Dr. R.L. Shelton -Late (Hardshell Calvinist Baptist), Dr. Alfred P. Gibbs - Late (Plymouth Brethern), Miles Stanford - Late, Dan Smedra, Old Regular Baptists, Dr. M.R. DeHaan, - Late, Harry Ironside, - Late, A.W. Tozer - Late, Leonard Ravenhill - Late, Johnathan Edwards - Late, Martin Luther - Late, John Wesley, -Late, Charles Spurgeon, -Late, John Bunyan, -Late, Pastor Doug Hammett, Andrew Murray, - Late.

    No thanks (Boo - Hiss) goes to: Jack Hyles, Billy Graham, Hyles-Anderson churches, Curtis Hudson, Bob Gray, Luis Palau, TBN, "easy-beliveism" or salvation without conviction and repentance, The Power Team, Mario Murillo, Baptist preachers who say that the before mentioned spiritual work is unnecssary, Benny Hinn (what an antichrist!), all the "fallen" televangelists and mega-church preachers (Thanks Ted), Modern Day Social Gospel, Modern Day Prosperity Gospel, Pentecostals, Church of Christ, and all other Acts 2:38'ers, Hyper-Calvinists (The Hardshell kind), and all other perpetrators I forgot to preach against.

    Despite all that and by His Grace we stand!

    :godisgood::laugh:

    :jesus: Saves! :thumbs:

    BYe!
     

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