Featured Those who concede errors in the Scriptures n order to remove conflict with science

Actually, those advocating for the Evolutionary aging need that, in order to account for the truth that the bible never teaches species evolve between ranks, only in the same ranks!

 

:applause::applause::applause:

 

Thanks for the rebuttal of nodak's remarks!

 

RevMitchell, OldRegular,

I don't believe either of you is all knowing, capable of looking into the minds and hearts of others.

So you have no way of knowing whether they are using science to interpret the Bible or vice versa.

Disagreeing with your interpretation of the Bible is just that--disagreeing with your interpretation, which by the way wasn't all that popular a few decades ago.

Debate is wonderful and sharpens our minds.

Denigrating others only convinces the Darwinists we are indeed offspring of the apes.

 

And On The Other Hand....

NODAK...I do agree that our discourse should always be accomplished in a civil manner and debate is good and generally beneficial....but that said...I believe that to give ANY credence or credibility to the unobservable and unproveable THEORIES of the Old Earth,"millions and billions" of years of the Evolutionists/Darwinists is a huge mistake. It's not even good Science! When excellent and soundly Biblical organizations like the venerable Institute For Creation Research and Answers in Genesis (and others)with their highly intelligent and well-credentialed staffs can offer reasonable, valid and sound Biblical interpretations of the existing evidence for YEC simply by interpreting that evidence by a Biblical worldview that does no interpretational "VIOLENCE" to the scriptures ...then that should be the choice of Bible believers who wish to give God the benefit of any doubts and ALL of their allegiance. Let the world have their "theories". We need to be true to the literal truths of our Creator.....NOT the lies of unbelieving heathens. The just shall live by FAITH! That is just my humble opinion.

Bro.Greg Perry Sr.:thumbs:raying:

 

Gregory, I find your view quite limited regarding this issue - probably because of your unwillingness to explore the other options.

In the course of disagreement there is one thing that is of utmost importance, the willingness to be open to change.
While it's admirable that you are firm about your beliefs, the age of the earth is an issue that is not a fundamental to the faith.
God reveals himself in a number of different ways, Scripture being just one of them.

Rob

 

Many still have trouble with omni-power, presence and intellect--attributes which no one has ever had or will have.

God is potter, man is clay. And we have the audacity to define God.

Are we spending too much time on Mars Hill? The Greeks are still spiritually bankrupt, along with their economic debacle.

Plato and Aristotle cannot save the soul.

God has given us another day to repent and get it right. What will we do with this opportunity?

Peace,

Bro. James

 

Just To Clarify....

Deacon,
I will willingly and gladly admit that "my view" is quite limited and even "narrow" NOW. What I believe as a Young Earth Creationist is a view I arrived at AFTER having all the other trash that the secular humanistic crowd tried to pump into my brain in the course of 12 plus years of Godless public education and the best efforts of sources such as National Geographic, the History Channel and other such secular sources. I HAVE considered the "other" side and have determined that it is lacking in fact and is ultimately spiritually BANKRUPT. I do believe that the convictions I hold to are the right ones from a strictly Biblical point of view. I believe the literal history as found in Genesis and if you have a Biblical and Christian worldview then that is all you need....in my opinion. Debate is good......but it should always lead TO God and a clearer understanding of His Word and His will...or it can be a big waste of time. "Love NOT the world........"

Bro.Greg

 

Of course I agree with concept that our views and beliefs should come from the scripture.

But the simple truth is there are many people who do not find the scripture and science to be in conflict.

That doesn't make them heretic, apostate, or caving in to secular humanism, godless public schools, or any of the other plethora of perjorative terms usually tossed at them.

They simply disagree with ONE interpretation of the Bible.

They may be wrong. They may be right. Most likely both sides haven't the foggiest idea what God did at the time of creation. Most likely both sides are doing some misinterpreting.

Making YEC a test of some sort to see if folks are really really really saved seems to be the order of the day, with all sorts of disrespect to what boils down to simply a different understanding of the scripture.

We keep separating and yelling about issues and pretty soon every Baptist church on earth will be a fellowship of one.

 

Not sure if it is completely overstating the point. Remember how important perception is. Sometimes, the "rowdy" ones confuse respect for acceptance. Or so it sometimes appears in textual communications. I am....at present.... OE with no "apologies", but I have the deepest respect for anyone holding a different position, knowing that "one yom" our questions and squabbles will be no more.

 

Nodak...I will admit that it IS sometimes tempting to want to use YEC,KJVO,Calvinism/Arminianism, tithing and some other of these types of "hot-button" issues to be tests of salvation or at the least, fellowship, but none of them are either,nor should they be. Salvation is by grace through faith in the finished work and shed Blood of Christ on the cross PLUS (or minus) NOTHING. It would be nice if we could all agree with each other on the types of things listed above but that will probably never happen this side of Heaven. In my own Christian life I have, as I have grown in the Lord, shifted some of my beliefs from one position to the other as I felt the Lord moving me to so do but I have tried to not burn bridges of true fellowship when these moves were a product of that growth in my walk with God (unless God directed me clearly otherwise in His Word. Those who choose to disagree or seperate from me I just tried to determine to pray for them and love them in the Lord even if it had to be from a distance. The Judgement Seat of Christ will be the great equalizer. In the meantime I try my best to practice the admonition of scripture in Titus 2:11-15 (actually the whole chapter is awesome). We should always defer to the clear,literal intrepretation and application of God's Word whether or not it agrees with the findings of much of the (so-called) science this world has to offer. I refer everyone back to Psalm 1:1-2. We should reject the counsel and wisdom (so-called) of ungodly men. Sadly we must also reject the counsel sometimes of men who may actually be saved but have departed from the counsel of God and His word to try to accomodate those in this world.

Bro.Greg:saint:

 

I am not trying to look into your mind or heart. I am simply stating what I believe Scripture teaches. I disagree with the Gap Theory, the Old Earth Theory, the Punctuated Equilibrium Theory, even the so-called Intelligent Design Theory. All are attempts to force the Revelation of God to fit the science of the day.

It is common knowledge that the Gap Theory which was popular some years ago was an attempt to reconcile the Bible with the so-called science of fossil ages. When it became obvious that the fossil ages were the result of circular reasoning or chasing your tail it became necessary to find some other way to reconcile the Bible with the science of the day, as indicated above.

Belief in the Creation account was not that popular a few decades ago! Surely you jest!

That is 1!

I don't believe I have denigrated anyone. I simply do not respect those views that contradict Scripture. But as long as it is a free country and I am not the Pope you are free to believe what you choose!

 

Creation Science is an attempt to "fit the science of the day" into the revelation of God too.

Your disrespect of others views and persistent declaration that other views contradict Scripture displays your ignorance of the matter - sadly it is a common problem in the church - lots of talk little understanding.

You wonder why the youth are turning away from the church?

A consequence of this wide-spread belief that believers can ignore the world around them is that young adults see the disconnect between real-life reality and Scripture - and Christianity becomes irrelevant.

Rob

 

We will disagree here, as many others will. Where I attend we are strong on the young earth theory. We do have three doctors, one surgeon and two general practitioners and a few engineers, just showing we have quite a few with shall we say a good education, not all lacking understanding.

I believe the youth or turning away from the church for the same reason as yesterday, the church is the establishment and they want it their way. I will say it is harder on them today going to college than it was for me, I had only one professor attack my Christian beliefs, where as my son who is 41 had all but one attack his Christian beliefs that is if his beliefs were brought up.

 

I’ve bumped up against this issue in the congregation where I worship.
My congregation, like yours, largely takes a young-earth position.
The quiet and tolerant minority believe in an old earth.

A YE position isn't so unusual among professionals.
Knowledge in one field of education does not always reflect an understanding of another (or an understanding of how the beliefs interact with each other).
I am quite curious how scientifically educated professionals reconcile their beliefs with the world around them.

I've found that an intolerance of some YE believers toward those that believe otherwise is an obstacle that is nearly insurmountable.
I believe it’s largely based upon the feeling that if Scripture says it – I’ll believe it unquestionably – not understanding that they merely believe one particular interpretation of Scripture – and there are other interpretations that may fit better with the revelation God supplies in his creation.

Bob it’s not the “young-earth” interpretation I’m arguing against – even though I disagree with it.

It’s the idea that you can separate God-breathed writings from the world we live in.

To think that you must believe a particularly narrow interpretation of Scripture even if it can be demonstrated by observation that it is suspect separates Scripture from the world we live in.
That’s not faith, it’s ignorance.

It's the same obstacle Galileo confronted and why I posted his thoughts in my first post of this thread.

Rob

 

No RevMitchell, "secular science" is founded upon the ability to question results.

You, on the other hand, are suggesting that a particularly narrow interpretation of Scripture should not be questioned.

Rob