Time travel...is it possible?

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by uhdum, Oct 4, 2001.

  1. uhdum

    uhdum
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    I guess this is the right forum for this...i don't know...figured i'd throw this out...anyone think time travel is possible? Now I'll give the generic sunday school answer that God won't allow it, but hey, let's hear what everyone has to say about it [​IMG] (sorry i've seen to much quantum leap and back to the future)
     
  2. Barnabas H.

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    No, it's not possisble. Not for us that is! Going back to the past to make things right, by changing the outcome, is Hollywood's idea of deifying man. It's my humble opinion. But then again, I may just have to climb into my foxhole because I hear the footsteps of those Star War fans...... ;)
     
  3. Helen

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    Time travel may be possible mentally via the imagination, but it is impossible physically. We live in a three dimensional universe which is subject to time. There is cause and effect and thus progression from one state to another. Going 'back' would change causes meaning that effects would be changed from where you started and thus you did not start where you started. You can see where this leads --

    Going forward? That would give you the chance to come back to now and change what was to happen later, meaning you never really visited the 'real' future at all.

    God Himself invented time and works through it in our lives. He has ordered it and it will stay as is until He changes it. We are as bound by time as we are by the three dimensional world we exist in.

    Genesis 1:1 has an interesting physics indication in it:

    In the beginning (time)
    God created ('bara' meaning 'brought into being from nothing previously existing')
    the heavens (space)
    and the earth (physical matter).

    Time, space, and mass are contained within that opening sentence and physics has found that we live in what is called a 'time/space/mass continuum.' None of those things have any meaning without the other two. Time cannot exist for us without space and mass, for we measure time by mass moving through space. The concept of space means nothing without time and mass to define it. Mass is impossible without time and space.

    Thus, to divorce yourself from the confines of time -- and specifically the time known as 'now' -- you would have to alter both mass and space as well.

    That's a tough one.

    Imagination is a lot of fun and a lot more easily done.
     
  4. Rockfort

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    Time travel is an absurd embicilic notion of science fiction freaks.
     
  5. Helen

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    Rockfort, the submarine was once in that category, too, as was man flying.

    Perhaps there are nicer ways to state your opinion, though?
     
  6. Rockfort

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    If time travel were real, those of us who dispute its reality could 'return' and negate our opinions.
     
  7. tyndale1946

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    Absolutely... God does it all the time!... Brother Glen
     
  8. Reklaw

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    I wouldn't say God travels in time or anything to the extent, as He isn't subject to His own creation. That pretty well makes him eternal, huh? [​IMG] I'm not going to bother discussing paradoxes, as I've already shut you down more than once about that subject uhdum. ;) For those that don't pick it up, I'm joking.

    Scientifically, examining the four dimensions of reality (considering relativity, gravity, etc.), it can be seen that if time is built on physical reality, or is at least a part of it (which is true considering relativity... if there wasn't such a thing then there'd be no subjection to time), then we can see that time is "alterable." This doesn't mean that we can change time or move it, but it is theoretically possible to perhaps move from one place to another by these means. The Philadelphia incident, although possibly misconstrued, may be evidence of such an occurence. Even under these circumstances, we aren't to define time as a circle or line of continuation moreso than the placement of existence. Not that time isn't, but under these conditions such a definition may be helpful.

    Using this as a general theory, it's possible to say, move from one point to another in an instant. This would have to go against Einstein's idea that once something moves beyond the speed of light then time continues to pass rapidly on the outside but within time has ceased and perpetual mass has been achieved. The alternative is to say that after this point time is no longer relative, and can be reissued when mass and speed are lowered. Of course, after ahceiving this state there really shouldn't be any physical bindings left to operate under, but anyhoo...

    I don't necessarily believe all that, but it's a theory I figured I'd throw out. Shoot it down or praise it if you want... doesn't matter a lick to me! [​IMG]
     
  9. p

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    The speed of light seems to be God's speed limit.

    If He had made it possible for us to violate that speed limit significantly, time travel *might* just be possible.

    Anyone familiar with Einstein's thought experiments concerning time/space and causation effect will remember what I'm talking about.

    It gets far too deep to try to expand upon.

    The problem with the proof remains though: Were it possible to actually violate the forward flow of the continuum, and go backwards, then great violence would be done to the causation/effect loop.

    The only way this can be accomplished is by violating God's Speed Limit, and that is C, the speed of light. And I don't mean by a fractional amount either, it would have to be several multiples of C.

    If it could ever be done, you would actually have effects happening first, and then causes afterward.

    Not very neat, and it makes the spaghetti sauce taste funny.

    For those of you who have NO clue what I'm talking about, I am not crazy.

    This is actually found in Einstein's essays of thought experiments on Space/Time/Causation. I wish I could remember the URL where I found it in a physics lab. My computer crashed since then, and I lost the web address.

    Once you figure out what the essays mean (and it's not easy), you can see how the thought experiments might be possible.

    Not that anyone would ever have the money, resources, inclination, or lifespan to accomplish such a thing.

    However, the stuff you see paraded around in science fiction movies/publications is pure rubbish. It's fun to read, but it has virtually no real science behind it.

    If I can find the URL, I will supply it here.

    My personal thought on this? God made sure *we* couldn't do it, that's for certain.

    In His Steps,

    Alex Peterson
    II Corinthians 10:5
     
  10. Reklaw

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    I'm a big fan of science-fiction, including time travel, but that doesn't mean I adhere to it. "Fiction..." :D In fact I was thinking of ending my current novel (writing, whatever you can call the poor thing) with a concept involving time travel, or at least control over matter via thought and relation of matter to time/quantum mechanics. It's a good thing to confuse people with... I confused uhdum's dad back in... 9th grade (was it?) with paradoxes. They weren't much good but that's pretty much the point.
     
  11. p

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    I was a science fiction fan for most of my life, from the 3rd grade until I was 44.

    Think I've read almost everything, but not quite.

    Haven't read much of it this past year. One has to pick and choose what one reads in it, since a great deal of it is so anti-God, or at least elevates mankind to that level.

    I don't think it is a sin to read or write sci-fi, but it's like any show on tv, some of it isn't the best to see/read.

    John Varley used to be one of my favorite writers. The guy was so imaginative, as was Arthur C. Clarke. But, they both slammed God so much, I had to put their writings away.

    It was a stabbing in my heart every time I would see their blind, callous words against my Saviour.

    I truly loved reading science ficiton. I sometimes wish there was a way I could still read it, and not get burned.

    Maybe someone can help give me a little balance on this?

    I have 2 walls full of sci-fi books I used to read, that I don't have the heart to crack the covers of, anymore.

    Sometimes, it seems downright dangerous.

    Does that sound silly?

    In His Steps,

    Alex Peterson
    II Corinthians 10:5
     
  12. Reklaw

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    Nope. If you feel led to not affirm or encourage such writings by reading them, that's a perfectly honorable thing to do. If we're judged according to what we know, then we're also obligated to judge what we do by how we feel in relation to God.

    As of now I have no objections towards this, but I haven't been around too long. If I find something in a book offensive I generally note to myself what is true and what is false and continue, in the hopes that reading the story will not only give me some sense of enjoyment in that it's a story, but also that it will enlighten me more as to what people think and are capable of imagining.

    Books are made to delve into the psyche and lead us to understand what we are and who we are. We can put these aside if we find them offensive, but we can also learn from their flaws and errors. Then again, we take the chance of corrupting ourselves or encouraging others down a path of corruption. We have the liberty to pursue such ideas as time travel in a purely mental capacity, but allowing them to adversely harm others in any form is something I think we'll all agree is beyond question. Basically, my point is that it's up to you to decide and guide certain things, and this is one of them. We just always have to be certain that we have Truth at our right hand ready to confront anything that may arise from such things. (No offense to the left-handers out there.) [​IMG]
     
  13. Nemesis

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    Of course time travel is possible!!!

    You just have to dress up in a cow outfit, jump up and down like a cheerleader on crack, wave a banana around like a madman, crank up a Spice Girls song full blast ... and then the universe will transport you to another time in desperation to get rid of you. :D
     
  14. charles

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    Petersonalexw,
    There was a special on tv a few days ago about man being able to go from one side of the universe to the other(by sattelite,I'm sure).

    Normally,it would take countless years to accomplish this,but they suggested that a new concept was being designed to move quickly through the universe by means of a Cable Tunnel.
    God bless,Charles
     
  15. Jimmy Higgins

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tyndale1946:
    Absolutely... God does it all the time!... Brother Glen<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Tyndale, God is incapable of traveling back in time because he is beyond time. Like in Kurt Vonnegut's book Slaughterhouse Five, God, as the aliens in the book, look at events like a mountain. To the left is the past, to the right is the future. God doesn't go back in time because he's everywhere already.
     
  16. Jimmy Higgins

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Nemesis:
    Of course time travel is possible!!!

    You just have to dress up in a cow outfit, jump up and down like a cheerleader on crack, wave a banana around like a madman, crank up a Spice Girls song full blast ... and then the universe will transport you to another time in desperation to get rid of you. :D
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Spice Girls?!?! Of course! :eek: I've been using Bannarama.
     
  17. Paul of Eugene

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    NO time travel isn't possible.

    The only way we EVER move from one place to another is by pushing on things. Even rockets push on the expanding gases coming out of the rocket engines. Einstein's theory of relativity proves that merely pushing on things will never get us moving faster than the speed of light, which would be necessary in order to travel in time.

    So it would take a miracle.
     
  18. QXR37

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    Paul of Eugene:
    The only way we EVER move from one place to another is by pushing on things. Even rockets push on the expanding gases coming out of the rocket engines. Einstein's theory of relativity proves that merely pushing on things will never get us moving faster than the speed of light, which would be necessary in order to travel in time.

    Actually, although Einstein's "special" theory of relativity does forbid accelerating to light speed and travelling back in time, his "general" theory of relativity does seem to allow for the possibility of time travel. General relativity is a theory about how gravity can be explained in terms of the curvature of spacetime, and there are some solutions to the field equations of GR which represent spacetimes twisted in such strange ways that "closed timelike curves" are possible; an object travelling along such a path in spacetime would end up returning to the place and time it started out at, which means it would have returned to its own past. No one knows how to unite quantum mechanics with general relativity though (string theory is a leading contender), so it's possible that these sorts of solutions will be forbidden by a future theory of quantum gravity. Anyway, here are some articles on the subject:

    http://www.boston.com/globe/magazine/5-23/past.shtml
    --brief Boston Globe article on time travel in modern physics and the problems it poses

    http://astron.berkeley.edu/~bmendez/html/time.html
    --more detailed page on the physics of time travel...some equations, but you don't have to understand them to get something out of the article

    http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/time-travel-phys/
    --very detailed article from the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy, detailing both the physical and philosophical aspects of time travel

    http://members.telocity.com/sorceror/timetravel.html
    --lighter article on the philosophy of time travel, various ideas about how paradoxes would be avoided and so forth

    [ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: QXR37 ]
     
  19. Timotheus

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    Time travel is possible indeed! Just fly to the far east. You'll gain a day and loose a day, depending which direction you fly. This way you become either older or younger one day! :D
     
  20. jaycwru

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Helen:
    We live in a three dimensional universe which is subject to time.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    You should look into string theory. The universe has many more than three dimensions, (the latest proposal I heard was 17!)
    http://superstringtheory.com/

    Here is a site with 11 dimensions: http://d0server1.fnal.gov/users/gll/public/edpublic.htm

    What a complex universe we live in!


    #include &lt;std_disclaimer.h&gt;
     

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