Timothy Was Not A Pastor, At Least In...

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by TCGreek, Apr 10, 2008.

  1. TCGreek

    TCGreek
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    I really don't think Timothy was a Pastor in the biblical sense, because a pastor was the same as an elder.

    Commentaries don't seem to make this obvious. It seems like they're fond of anachronism.
     
  2. webdog

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    Is this the study of very large snakes? :laugh:
     
  3. TCGreek

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    That's a good one. :laugh:
     
  4. AAA

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    I thought that a elder was the same as deacon?
     
  5. Rubato 1

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    Now, Paul knew about snakes...and could certainly teach Timothy a thing or two about anachronism...:laugh:

    But this is a good point. Paul gave Timothy the req. for a pastor, etc. Why? So that he could live up to them? or so that he knew who to appoint (or recommend) pastor in the churches he worked with.

    TCGeek, what do you think Timothy was? An 'evangelist'? A simple messenger-boy for Paul?
     
  6. Amy.G

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    No. That would be Anachondanism.
     
  7. webdog

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    In most baptist churches, it is.
     
  8. Amy.G

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    Whatever Paul was (pastor, deacon, elder) was what Timothy was, since Paul appointed him to take his place, knowing he was about to die.
     
  9. webdog

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    Ah...good point. Since we know Paul wasn't an elder (pastor), we can conclude Timothy wasn't either.
     
  10. TCGreek

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    In some Baptist churches that is the case, but I believe that is a departure from Scrpture.

    Elders are clearly distinct from Deacons (1 Tim 3; Titus; Phil 1:1).
     
  11. TCGreek

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    Repeatedly Paul tells us how he viewed himself: herald, teacher and apostle, never pastor/elder or deacon (1 Tim 2:7; 2 Tim 1:11).

    Given that a pastor/elder had to be at a local church, Paul would not be, since he was more of a missionary.
     
  12. Amy.G

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    We know Paul was an apostle, but I don't think Timothy was because my personal belief is that an apostle was one appointed by the Lord Himself through personal contact.

    So, was he a missionary? Church planter?

    Interesting.
     
  13. TCGreek

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    Now this I agree with, for it seems to be more in line with Scripture.

    I would say a missionary, church planter, apostle, teacher and herald but with apostolic authority and the heart of a pastor.
     
  14. DHK

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    Paul left Timothy to be the pastor at Ephesus. There are many young pastors throughout the nation, and very effective ones at that. The Bible does not stipulate that a pastor be "old," but simply "not a novice," which implies that he knows his Bible well, and has been in the ministry long enough to know how to be a shepherd of the flock.
    The word "elder" has two meanngs:
    One is the denotation, as in older.
    However the other is "senior," as in senior pastor. Remember that that the early churches had a plurality of pastors. One of them had to have oversight of all. He became the senior pastor, or elder, regardless of his age. Older pastors were also entitled to the designation of "elder" as well.
     
  15. webdog

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    He was the first century Rick Warren :D
     
  16. TCGreek

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    Yet Paul never refers to Timothy as a pastor.

    Rather, he refers to him as a good diakonos and euangelistes (1 Tim 4:6; 2 Tim 4:5).

    For example, in 1 Tim 5:17-25 Timothy is clearly not an elder/pastor.
     
  17. Amy.G

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    HYJACK!




    :laugh:
     
  18. Amy.G

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    And isn't a pastor to be over just one church? Where as Paul had authority over all the churches that he himself started. Timothy must have been given the same type of authority as Paul since Paul chose him to be his replacement.

    Just thinking out loud.
     
  19. webdog

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    ...WHO DRINKS!! :tonofbricks:
     
  20. TCGreek

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    Amy, I see Timothy's role at Ephesus as different than that of the elders.

    Timothy's role was in preaching and teaching the word with authority and insistence.

    The elders were to care for the church and direct the affairs of the church.

    Paul was only passing through Ephesus like had done with other churches (Acts 14:22f).

    It was never his intention to stay there for a long period.

    In fact, in Acts 20:17, 28-31 it is the elders that Paul addresses and told to shepherd and protect the flock. This was at Ephesus.

    Paul even predicted defection and some of them actually did (1 Tim 1:19, 20).
     

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