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Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Askjo, Jan 20, 2005.
Deafposttrib, I am waiting on you. Please explain what it means.
This does not belong in the School forum. Will move it to Theology.
Holding my breath until I learn what it is to "know" what "touch" means.
(ALT) Now concerning [the things] of which you* wrote to me: [it is] good for a man not to be touching a woman [sexually].
(BBE) Now, as to the things in your letter to me: It is good for a man to have nothing to do with a woman.
(CEV) Now I will answer the questions that you asked in your letter. You asked, "Is it best for people not to marry?"
(Darby) But concerning the things of which ye have written to me : It is good for a man not to touch a woman;
(DRB) Now concerning the things whereof you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.
(EMTV) Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.
(ESV) Now concerning the matters about which you wrote: "It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman."
(GB) Nowe concerning the thinges whereof ye wrote vnto mee, It were good for a man not to touche a woman.
(GNT) Περὶ δὲ ὧν ἐγράψατε μοι, καλὸν ἀνθρώπῳ γυναικὸς μὴ ἅπτεσθαι·
(GNT-TR) περι δε ων εγραψατε μοι καλον ανθρωπω γυναικος μη απτεσθαι
(GNT-WH+) περι4012 PREP δε1161 CONJ ων3739 R-GPN εγραψατε1125 V-AAI-2P καλον2570 A-NSN ανθρωπω444 N-DSM γυναικος1135 N-GSF μη3361 PRT-N απτεσθαι680 V-PMN
(KJV+) Now1161 concerning4012 the things whereof3739 ye wrote1125 unto me:3427 It is good2570 for a man444 not3361 to touch680 a woman.1135
(LITV) But concerning what you wrote to me, it is good for a man not to touch a woman;
(UPDV) Now concerning the things whereof you+ wrote: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.
(YLT) And concerning the things of which ye wrote to me: good it is for a man not to touch a woman,
(Ya gotta love that e-sword)
Interesting that the ESV is considered fairly literal to interpret this so dynamically.
It means keep your hands to yourself until you're married.
OOPS! I owe you a big thank for moving it to right forum.
I was waiting on Deafposttrib to explain what it means because I know him. I just want to see his answer on 1 Cor. 7:1 because of Hyles church.
Sorry for delay to reply back on 1 Cor. 7:1. Because this is not belong to college debate. Dr. Bob is correct, this should be move to theology, for doctrine discuss.
I can read 1 Cor. 7:1 in King James Version well.
I understand the context of chapter 7, Apostle Paul was discuss about sex.
I think, Paul was strict and very concerning about anyone on sex.
I have no idea, what was looking like in their culture and custom during Paul's time relates with sex, when man greeting to a woman, I do not think, a man touch woman while greeting such as 'hug' or 'handshake' in Paul's time.
Notice, Paul wrote, it says, 'holy kiss'. Notice some nations of today's, man kisses to man's cheek for greeting each other, I consider, it was part of 'holy kiss' in their custom throughout many centuries. Probably, man does 'holy kiss' to a woman for greeting.
To hearing members of Baptistboard, let you know, deaf's culture is different as hearing's culture. Deaf's culture, when deaf man greeting to deaf woman, they hug each other. They were not thinking of having sex. They just greeting each other, that's all. Secondly, deaf person cannot hear voice from other person for calling person's name. So, a deaf person pats at deaf person's shoulder, for get pay attention.
Several years ago, my deaf friend told me, he went to deaf camp in West Virgina, that camp is running by First Baptist Church of Hammond, IN. He tried to call lady's name, he knows lady is deaf, he just petting his hand on lady's shoulder, but, camp staff told him, no, can't do that. He have to wave his hand toward lady's eye for get pay attention.
Many colleges and churches have good reasons for their standards and rules to protect their people from being fall into sin. I was a student at Midwestern Baptist College. That college's rule, man student must be apart 6 inches away from woman student's shoulder.
I was student at BIMI Deaf Bible College(now Deaf Harvest Bible College) of Ringgold, GA, that college's standard & rules is little lower than T.T.U, Midwestern Baptist College, Crown College, etc. Deaf college does not set its rule on 6 inches apart between man and woman. Because deaf college knows deaf culture's way. Even, all deaf students are hugging each other while greeting same time.
Many deaf ministries, churches at Baptist churches, doing their own culture, by hugging each other.
I doubt of deaf ministry at First Baptist Church of Hammond, IN is allow deaf people to huge each other by greeting. Dr. Bill Schutt, deaf pastor of FBC, he KNOWS deaf culture well. But, he have to obey FBC's rule & standard.
You want to know, what my view or intepreting word, 'touch'.
Well, I know what it means.
I am not sure what Paul's specific area of 'touch', he was talking about. But, I understand what he talking about, sex.
We are aware and realize, when we just touch person's body, it could affect our feeling and lust leading us into temptation for sex. But, deaf culture, include me, when I greeting deaf ladies, at the church, I shaked their hands, also, sometime hugged them. While hugging deaf ladies, I do NOT think of sex with person or feeling any lust. Just greeting them each other, that's all.
We should use our common sense, while having date with person, do not reach within our arm cover person's shoulder for a length time, it might lead us into temptation of lust developing. Just chatting each other, that's all.
My friends who were graduated from deaf college. Before they get married. He told to missionary honest, and did showed picture of him and his girlfriend(now wife), as they were hugging each other, for fun. He knows, 'touch' means sex. They were the first students married under BIMI Deaf Bible College in 1999. Now, they still have happy married and have 4 years old son. Also, he is a deaf pastor of deaf church in Georgia.
I think he understands 'touch' very well, because, he awares, if really WANT to touch his girlfriend by hugging so hardly, or kissing(French kiss) so deep, MIGHT lead into lust and sex developing later. He does not have to doing that, it was not necesscary to do that to his girlfriend, just walking together, chatting each other, even, hugging for purpose. He NEVER break his virgin, or sex with his girlfriend. He does the right thing.
Another true story of good example.
Apostle Paul says, if a person feels 'burn', better get marry immediately.
Students at Bible college, they were epoused, planning to get marry next 9 months. I remember, a man student told me, he will be marry to her(student) in July(next 10 months). But, in the next days, I didn't see him in the class. For in the next past few weeks. I was puzzled, what's happened to him. So, I asked to the teacher, where he is. She told me, his girlfriend got pregancy! They were forced to get marry last minute. At the same time, they were dropped out of Bible college.
Being espoused little over a year is not good, easier for a person to get burn, and break virgin, get into mess up. Wiser for couple to have espoused betwen 6 to 9 months being prevent from making big mistake.
My friend does the right thing, he refused sex with his girlfriend before get married, he knows better, not dumb to making big mistake. He controls his feelings, emotions, and lust. He just hugging her, that's all. He refused to sleep or lie with his girlfriend.
Many Christians made so many mistakes.
In my view of 'touch' means sex, or break virgin.
Use our common sense, NEVER, never open pant, or, lie on bed with a person before get marry.
Askjo, what do you think of 'touch'. I would like to hear your comment on it.
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!
p.s. by the way, my home in Michigan is SNOWING so heavy! It is beautiful outside!!
Paul is not commanding anything in this verse. He is responding to a question from the Corinthians about whether or not they should have sexual relations.
That's true, Daniel---but although its still not a command---it still must be obeyed! This verse is to be "lived out" through our obedience!
Very thorough and IMO very accurate presentation of the issue.
There is NOTHING to be obeyed in verse 1! That was DD's point!
It is good if a man (or woman) can live in a state of singleness. Nevertheless, most people cannot handle the single life while maintaining sexual purity, so, Paul says, “get married”! The passage does NOT say that men are not to "touch" women!
Agreed, DPT did an excellent job.
These verses MUST be read in context.
I often get frustrated with preachers who jump all over the Bible pulling one verse here, one verse there, and one verse whereever to prove a point. I would MUCH rather study an entire chapter or section in the Bible and if references to other locations are made, study them in context, too.
I am getting a little tired of what is called "word studies" by some pastors who use their new computer software to locate a particular word and quote all of the verses, because now it is so easy to do this.
Understanding of the Bible will drop as people quit reading sections in context. IMHO
I tell our people there are three rules of Bible interpretation...
2) Context, and
Not an original, I have no idea where I first heard it, but I have used it enough to claim it as mine now!
AND, they have heard it so much that all I have to say is "Three rules..." and they fill in... "Context, Context, Context."
That is true. In deaf culture most deaf people hugged and said each other, Hello. Deaf culture is much different from the hearing culture because deaf people are MORE senstitive than hearing people.
PCC in Fla has its rules - 12 inches!
That is very odd.
That is your theology. I respect your theology and belief.
1 Cor. 7:1 talks about the marriage life, not only sex because Paul explained on the chapter 7 of 1 Cor. about having trouble in the marriage life such as unsaved, staying in marriage, etc,. Paul pointed out that a man stays being single and has troublefree in his life.
A wife gets angry at her husband as likewise as a husband gets at his wife so they clashed each other. Do you know that most spouses have many troubles such as fighting each other, money problems, baby crying, kids behaving bad, etc,.? Troubles?
If anyone believes that 1 Cor 7:1 refers to sex only, that mean they agree with Roman Catholic's belief and practice.
DeafPosttrib, what do you think of my comment on 1 Cor. 7:1?