USA spying Europe : what do you think about that ?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Spear, Jul 1, 2013.

  1. Spear

    Spear
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2009
    Messages:
    236
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi,

    I used to think " We're probably doing/trying to do the same ", but anyway, is it normal between allies ?

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/30/nsa-leaks-us-bugging-european-allies

    When you read " The documents reviewed by Der Spiegel showed that Germany was treated in the same US spying category as China, Iraq or Saudi Arabia, while the UK, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand were deemed to be allies not subject to remotely the same level of surveillance. ", I think there's enough for german to feel offended, no ?

    I'm not here for polemics, just wondering what american mostly think ?
     
  2. poncho

    poncho
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    19,657
    Likes Received:
    128
    The Guardian released another shocking NSA scoop on Saturday, revealing collusion and mass harvesting of personal communications among the United States and at least six European Union countries — only to delete it from their website hours after publication.

    The article, titled "Revealed: secret European deals to hand over private data to America," was written by Jamie Doward, who reported information from Wayne Madsen, a former Navy Lt. and NSA employee for 12 years.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q9B6j3owcM&feature=player_embedded <--- listen to Wayne Madsen interview.

    This has all been known for awhile now. What do most Americans think about it? Nothing if we can help it. I've been reporting on it here for years and no one cared . . . until now. In the USA when ever there is a "new MSM revelation" about government corruption and crimes we play this little game. It's called "pin the blame on the donkey and elephant". The democratic party being the donkey and the republican party being the elephant. Each side takes turns trying to pin the blame on the other side until we get tired of playing then we move on to the next "new MSM revelation" about government corruption and crimes. Then it starts all over again.

    The object of the game is to prove the other side is more corrupt than our side. You'd think the object of the game would be to hold corrupt politicians accountable and prosecute them for their crimes against us all . . . but it isn't.

    The result is that we now have an authoritarian government that knows no limit to it's power over all our lives.

    Ron Paul Blasts NSA Defenders On Piers Morgan: 'You're Justifying Dictatorship!'

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9gqIPJgN_E
     
    #2 poncho, Jul 1, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 1, 2013
  3. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    38,356
    Likes Received:
    789
    The "USA" is not spying on anyone. It is a few people in the government that is spying and it should not be so.
     
  4. poncho

    poncho
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    19,657
    Likes Received:
    128
    According to the government it's all being done to protect us from the Islamic extremists the government is funding and arming.

    The Terrorists already knew, and have long known, that the US government is doing everything possible to surveil their telephonic and internet communications. The Chinese have long known, and have repeatedly said, that the US is hacking into both their governmental and civilian systems (just as the Chinese are doing to the US). The Russians have long known that the US and UK try to intercept the conversations of their leaders just as the Russians do to the US and the UK.

    They haven’t learned anything from these disclosures that they didn’t already well know. [He's right.] The people who have learned things they didn’t already know are American citizens who have no connection to terrorism or foreign intelligence, as well as hundreds of millions of citizens around the world about whom the same is true. What they have learned is that the vast bulk of this surveillance apparatus is directed not at the Chinese or Russian governments or the Terrorists, but at them.

    CONTINUE . . .

    Is Mass Spying Being Used to Make Some People Rich?

    We’ve previously documented that the government has been giving our private information to big companies so they can make money. And see this.

    The Wall Street Journal reported that the NSA spies on Americans’ credit card transactions. Many other agencies are doing the same. In fact, virtually all U.S. intelligence agencies – including the CIA and NSA – are going to spy on Americans’ finances. The IRS will also be spying on Americans’ shopping records, travel, social interactions, health records and files from other government investigators.

    Not only can the NSA intercept and store virtually all digital communications on the Internet, but private contractors can also view all of your data (and the government isn’t keeping track of which contractors see your data and which don’t). And because background checks regarding some contractors are falsified, it is hard to know the types of people that might have your information.

    In an articled entitled “How Much Are the NSA and CIA Front Running Markets?”, Naked Capitalism reports:

    CONTINUE . . .
     
    #4 poncho, Jul 1, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 1, 2013
  5. Dennis324

    Dennis324
    Expand Collapse
    Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Messages:
    146
    Likes Received:
    0
    Its been my understanding that all countries spy. Israel (one of our best allies) has spied on us. We spy on most everyone. Par for the course. I just assume that everyone out there is spying on us as well. :)
     
  6. Spear

    Spear
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2009
    Messages:
    236
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think that, any country it might come from, the problem is when spying is not for military/terrorism purposes, but when military ways of spying are being used for commercial purposes.

    And that's the matter now. We are trying to build the biggest market between Europe/USA, and the negociations to be started are already clouded by that Prism thing ....

    I truly think spying should remain to the military/security sphere (even if it doesn't prevent excesses or abuses), and by no way be used by countries to support (private, of liberal economy) business.
     
  7. Arbo

    Arbo
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,942
    Likes Received:
    1
    *USA spying Europe : what do you think about that ?

    I think it is prudent.
     
  8. poncho

    poncho
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    19,657
    Likes Received:
    128
    Amazing! You actually get it! I wish the people in this country would get it.

    Can't say I'm sorry about hurting the prospect of further globalizing our economies though. Why should any nation want to put their economy in the hands of the people that have ruined the economies of so many other nations and put them in perpetual debt bondage?

    Iceland got it right when it arrested the bankers that ruined it's economy and gave the IMF and World Bank a one way ticket straight out of Iceland. :thumbsup:
     
    #8 poncho, Jul 2, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2013

Share This Page

Loading...