Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Pastoral Ministries' started by td, Apr 27, 2003.
Anyone use paraments, robes or candles in your worship services? How about robed acolytes?
This is a BAPTIST ONLY forum! (I know you know that!)
Just wondering what KIND of Baptist would even know what an "acolyte" was, much less ever burn one?
An acolyte is a person in training, or assistant.
I always wore a Geneva gown and clergy collar, the choirs wore robes, but that was it so far as paraphernalia is concerned.
The Geneva gown has pretty much disappeared from Baptist circles as has the clergy collar, but I still wear my collar at some events.
When I first came to Canada, the normal pulpit garb for most Baptists was striped trousers and tails, which quickly changed to a short jacket. The mourning trousers also disappeared. Most Baptists to-day, in Canada, wear regular street clothes....suit and tie...in the pulpit.
I think it used to be fairly common in urban areas for Baptist ministers to wear Genevan robes and I am familiar with some who still do.
Wearing collars, robes is fairly common among many black Baptist churches and I believe (But not sure) that some in the Alliance of Baptists, American Baptist churches USA do. It's not a big deal to me one way or the other. We put robes on our choirs and would not have to worry about which business suit to pick out and a collar would take less time than figuring out which tie I'm wearing tommorrow.
Acolytes would be a good idea if most Baptists knew how to act when coming in the House of God. Too often in Baptist churches there is liitle silence before worship but talk of politics, sports, cutting up etc..in the sanctuary which is a major distraction.
From what Jim said, An associate pastor or an intern would be an acolyte. If that is the case, perhaps more churches need acolytes. I help the pastor with ministries and am learning from that experience. I am learning more about pastoral ministry from working under an experienced pastor than I have in reading numerous books.
I never had an assistant in all my ministry, but always picked out a young person or deacon to assist me in services. I especially liked to have a young person. He would read scripture and lead in prayers. It opened up the service to youth.
On being quiet beforehand, I think a good organist can help in this department. Playing soft music before the service. In one church, we often had a soloist sing before the service, or a group......anything to lead into worship.
The collar helped when it came to visitation in some institutions here. Never had a problem getting into hospitals and other people, besides the baptist members I was visiting, would ask questions and ask for prayer. Yes, I never liked ties! Did I mention that I don't like ties?
From MY side of the pew... I REALLY am uncomfortable when a minister is in robes or has those scarves around his neck. We attended American Baptist when we lived in Conn. and I always felt like we had wandered into a Presbyterian church. I never felt at home....
I don't suppose you'll see anyone like Adrian Rogers or Charles Stanley in a pulpit robe. But I have been in "moderate" churches in Texas and North Carolina where the ministers wear pulpit robes. Also, some Calvinistic congregations like FBC Charleston, SC, and Magnolia Street Baptist in Greensboro feature pastors in pulpit robes(the pastor at Magnolia Street only wore his during Advent, Lent, and the Sunday in October closest to "Reformation Day").
Regarding pastors on the Baptist Board: Rev Joshua is 10000 times more likely to wear a pulpit robe on the Lord's day than Dr Bob is
Yeah, I think Joshua stated that he did wear a robe during the service. Thanks to all for your comments!
AMEN TO THAT! I do have a lovely robe (blue velvet striping - I have a doctor of ministries) and use it on special occasions like baccalaureate upcoming on June 1.
But a pulpit robe? Maybe in my next life . . Right now, wearing a BOW TIE is enough of challenge to show my superior spirituality.
We do wear collars and the old Geneva Gowns. Likewise, we have paraments and vestments of the appropriate colors for the church year. Although most baptists in the U.S. were heavily influenced by frontier religion, our church is of the vein that was not.
If you want to read more about our worship, I've written a lengthy description of it for our website:
Worship at Virginia-Highland
Oops, missed the second part of the question. Yes, we use robed acolytes as well.
The pastor at Fremont, Jay Zaremba, is a big candle guy (or actually a big lots-of-little-candles guy). He likes to have two or three dozen little teawarmers (about a third the size of a votive) going to illustrate his theology. The fumes have aroused discontent among some who are a bit chemically sensitive. JBC has a taper or two going in Nichigo, and a monogrammed pillar usually unlit in English.
If by paraments you mean calendar-appropriately colored cloths on the communion table and dangling off the pulpit, then Japanese Baptist makes prominent use of them in the Nichigo service. I think they're there in the English service, too, but not as prominent.
None of my pastors customarily wears a robe to preach, though I think all of them have them and might use them on special occasions.
Haruo, the large, unlit candle is probably the Paschal candle. It is only lit during the Easter season, for baptisms, and for funerals.
But it wasn't lit that I could see last Sunday, and unless I'm mistaken we were then (and are now) in the Easter season.
Yup, if it's the paschal candle it should be lit every Sunday until Pentecost. I dunno then. Maybe they just think it's pretty.
Sounds like Church of England to me....
I think most Baptists could benefit from the Church calendar and a more move toward Liturgy.
During Holy Week I attended services at a nearby Episcopal Church since my church was not having Maundy Thursday services.
As I entered the Church I noticed several things
1. Silence - You could hear a pin drop. Baptist often associate being quiet with deadness. This quiet was a reverancial quietness. Too often in our Baptist churches there is to much talking and joking. There was the attitude I am coming into the presence of the Holy Trinity.
2. Prayer - I noticed people at their pews kneeling on the kneelers in silent prayer. I too engaged in this. Too often our churches are not houses of prayer yet this is what impressed me the most about this church.
3. Expectation- There was a expectation of encoutering God in worship. The 15 minutes I arrived before worship had put a sense in your heart that this was a place to encounter God. Because there was no talk of politics, sports etc..in the sanctuary, the sanctuary seemed to be a place that transcended time, space and politics (Excuse the Star Trek like talk ) and that we had entered a window to Heaven.
The service lasted one hour and 45 minutes yet it seemed to go by quickly. The constant flow of liturgical prayer and the lack of dead time that is common in Baptist churches made this a true worship experience. At the conclusion of the service all the lights went out (except for a few candles) and we recited Psalms 22 and then everyone left the Church without saying a word. Some remained and prayed silently as did I. It was one of the most moving and humbling of services I have ever been in.
I think in this day of seeker services, 3 hymns, sermon services, Contemporary Praise and Worship services that all seem to be human centered that we Baptists could learn much from this type of service. Contrary to what most Baptists think, Liturgical worship is not dead, stale or restricted. One of the things I wish Baptists would do is have silence before worship service and a sense of expectation of meeting the Transcendant God in our services.
For you interesting there is a Liturgical Baptists email discussion group that I moderate at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/liturgicalbaptists/
This is not a debate forum but a friendly, relaxed sharing of ideas and questions are welcome for those curious or unfamiliar with Liturgy. Attacks on Liturgy or liturgical baptists however will not be tolerated and will result in a automatic ban (Hey, I Didn't say it was a democracy! )
[ May 03, 2003, 03:32 PM: Message edited by: Kiffin ]
I personally don't do robes. Just a question of preference and comfort for me. For those of you who think Free church folks shouldn't don a robe, Martyn Lloyd Jones thought the preacher was sinning if he didn't have one on when preaching
I do a little more with candles than I used to, only around Advent though.
I do agree that we need to recover a bit more of the lectionary and the Christian year.