Utah Gunman was a Bosnian Muslim Refugee

Amen!! an we need to keep fighting for that right.:thumbs:

 

According to the CIA Factbook (linkie), there were about 6,525,170,264 people in the world as of last July. Of these, slightly more than 20% are Muslim which is about 1,305,034,052 people. A simple majority would be about 652,517,027.

You think over 650 million Muslims are violent extremists? I think there'd be a lot more trouble in the world if this were true.

 

Here is one.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/011941.php

 

Here is another one.

http://billroggio.com/archives/2005/08/the_seven_phase.php

 

I too cannot understand this apathy. The same thing happened with the church in Germany during the rise of Hitler to power. They were all taken up with this new German pride that they didn't see it coming. As I said I've brought this matter up in other forums. But they just think I'm a nutcase. Well I suppose they're right in one sense. But not where this is concerned. I've even challenged Muslims about it, but they remain silent.

 

I agree. And no that is not what I said. You see, what happens is that there only needs to be a handful of violent or extreme Muslims, or extreme anyone if it comes to it and the others fall into line. We just need to take lessons from what has happened in the past with any despotic force. Germany for instance before the last war. The Nazi party was by no means the majority party and even then not all Nazis were extreme or violent. But they took over Germany none the less.

Similarly before the "reformation" in Iran the ones who instigated the Islamic revival were not the majority. But it happened all the same. The "moderates" although they are not necessarily violent and do not necessarily agree with suicide bombers etc, nevertheless when challenged always justify their actions with excuses for the violence. It is either US policy in the middle east, or it is Britain's policy which is a remnant of the old emperical thinking etc.

And most of these moderates have criticisms in one form or another about "The West" and its "crusades" against Muslims. Therefore it is these people who are really the dangerous Muslims. Because most of the time they say nothing when their are killings or bombings and most Muslims hate the Jews and therefore look upon the US as assisting the Jews in Israel against the Arab states, which they call Muslims. There is such a thing as being "pacively" violent. That is when someone who is able to do something actually does nothing.

I speak with Muslims every day and yes some of them, even most of them are decent hardworking citizens. But just look at what happened when houses were raided in London and men were arrested for a suspected plot to kidnap and behead British Muslim soldiers. The whole Muslim community, instead of supporting the police in this suspected crime, were all up in arms about the "unjust way" these people were treated and you got allegations about Britain being a police state and the like. Of course they overlook the reason some of them came to Britain. It was to get away fron a police state. Some were released after a few days. In a police state an innocent person can be banged up for years. This they conveniently forgot.

Islam is a peaceful religion as long as you go along with it. Do a search of Christians under persecution and my guess is you will find that most Islamic countries persecute Christians in one way or another. For example. the US and Britain count Saudi Arabia as a friendly Muslim country. But did you know it is a criminal offence to preach the gospel there? And this is so in most Islamic countries. This peaceful religion prevents the gospel of peace from being preached.

ps: It is an easy thing to get ordinary peaceful folk worked up into extreme behaviour. If you've ever read William Shakespeare's Julius Caesar. In a speech after Caesar was murdered by Brutus and others Brutus used reason to show how Caesar was indeed a tyrant and all the people agreed with him. Then when he had departed Mark Anthony came on the scene and proceed to work on the "emotions" of the crowd. Remember, he got their attention by saying "Friends, Romans countrymen, lend me your ears. I come to bury Caesar, not to praise him". But you read on and that is exactly what he ended up doing. In the end the crowd "ordinary peaceful people" were worked up into such an emotional state that in the end that same crowd who said "this Caesar was a tyrant". Were now saying, "We'll burn the house of Brutus". This is exactly how moderate peaceful Muslims are being worked on in British "moderate" mosques today. They are getting these firebrand imams or teachers who are working on the moderates by putting it into their heads that they are being unjustly dealt with and that there is some kind of crusade or conspiracy going on by the west against Islam.

 

Thank you LadyEagle. This puts the acts of these suicide bombers sharply into context.

 

I am against allowing muslims to immigrate until such time as those that are already here have melded into the general society.

Is anyone surprised?

 

Yes, that is what I'm concerned about here. There is little I can do about violent extremists, especially those overseas, but I do not want people in my country getting so worked up over them that they think they are doing God's work by attacking peaceful American Muslims.

Hate propaganda is effective. Once enough people buy into the notion that the only good Muslim is a dead Muslim, well, they will not be acting in accordance with Jesus.

 

Sad . . .

What about the peaceful American non-Muslim that is killed for serving in the US Army defending a bunch of Muslims . . . ?

Oh well. Hate propaganda is effective - the enemy continues to attack. . . and America is blamed for the good Muslims that think the only good American is a dead American.

Too bad we cannot stop the Muslim press machine. The American press machine is difficult enough to keep track of . . .

 

Of course not. I'm not advocating that at all. Neither do I agree with attacking anyone whoever they may be. But that doesn't mean we can't look at these things sensibly and assess the situation. But a good way of assessing any religion or political movement or anything if it comes to it, is to look at the beinnings of that movement. You can use this method when assessing heresies and cults as well. In other words look at the early writings. In the case of Islam, read the Quran and not only the Quran, but also the Hadith. Because Muslims are guided a lot by what the Hadith says. That has always been my method. Don't make a judgement on current events alone. But make your judgement after you have read those (Islamic) scriptures that drive those people who are creating those current events. This doesn't mean that we don't take into account what Muslims are saying today. Another thing I get very suspicious of is politicians quoting scripture. I think they must make up their minds whether they want to be preachers or politicians.

 

I think American soldiers are being blamed for many things unjustly. I listen to Muslims saying things like "These American soldiers are killing millions of Muslims worldwide and plundering own homes and murdering our children and raping our women". Now that amounts to serious war crime and if it were true would be taken very seriously by the rest of the Allied forces and also the war crimes commission. When I read or hear that kind of accusation I say "Where is your proof? Show me examples of these crimes against Muslims" But of course they go silent. Because there is no proof. It is just something that is said in order to villify America.