Venting on out of context uses of scripture

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Marcia, Nov 20, 2008.

  1. Marcia

    Marcia
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    11,139
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have to start this thread just so I can vent on seeing "where two or three are gathered together" used over and over out of context! I must see or hear this it seems like once a week!

    I always hear or read people using this as though it's saying if 2 or 3 Christians are together, God is there. But of course, there doesn't have to be 2 or 3 Christians around for God to be there.

    The passage (Matt. 18) is actually about church discipline.

    Am I not correct?

    Are there other verses you hear that are used out of context or misused? This is your chance to vent.

    Even if no one else posts, I got to vent on this one.
     
  2. Amy.G

    Amy.G
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    You are correct, and I would like to join your venting! :laugh:

    I've heard this sooo many times and it irritates me because as you say, it is taken out of context. God is with me at all times whether another person is with me or not.
    The verse is talking about the procedure for church discipline and relates to the Jewish law of having at least 2 witnesses.

    Another verse taken out of context is:
    Phl 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
     
    #2 Amy.G, Nov 20, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2008
  3. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,404
    Likes Received:
    328
    "Eye hath not seen,nor ear heard,neither have entered into the heart of man,the things which we can build." :Bill Clinton

    It won't be long before Obama rivals Clinton with respect to taking Bible passages out of context.
     
    #3 Rippon, Nov 20, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2008
  4. J.D.

    J.D.
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    8
    Marcia, I believe you are absolutely right. I call it the doctrine of "Church Agency", or the Church's role as God's "agent" or representative in the world. It is a validation of the seriousness of church discipline. "There am I" - that is, The Lord is presiding over the judgement. Remember that guy in Corinth? He was "turned over to Satan". So we undertand that when one is being disciplined by a church, they are also being disciplined by God Himself.

    But this doctrine was carried too far by the Roman Church. The Church opinions and the men that held them became equal to God's word. So even though we take it to be true that those under Church discipline are in fact under God's discipline, we nevertheless remember that church discipline is not infallible, and sometimes God is actually on the side of the one being disciplined.
     
  5. J.D.

    J.D.
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    8
    Have you heart that audio of Obama ridiculing the use of the Bible in making law? After that, I don't see how even he could have the gall to quote scripture.
     
  6. Marcia

    Marcia
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    11,139
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks, Amy.

    Want to say how you see this used out of context?

    Whoever posts something should explain how it's misused. That way, we all learn!
    :1_grouphug:
     
  7. Amy.G

    Amy.G
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Oops.
    In this verse (Phil. 4:13) Paul is talking about how he is able to endure even the worst situations because it is Christ who strengthens him.

    People want to apply this verse to just about anything in their lives that seems impossible.
    "I can get that job I've always wanted because Christ strengthens me."

    God does not promise us our every wish because we trust in Christ to strengthen us, but He does promise to be our strength when we are weak and have to endure hardship.
     
  8. J.D.

    J.D.
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    8
    I remember there was a thread a while back on Christian buzzwords and phrases. It was pretty intersting and funny too. That's what these things become - buzzwords that get thrown around. Like the preacher that says "bless God" between every phrase of the sermon. It sounds like cussing to me.
     
  9. Marcia

    Marcia
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    11,139
    Likes Received:
    0
    Here's another one:

    Unless the LORD builds the house,They labor in vain who build it;Unless the LORD guards the city,The watchman keeps awake in vain. Ps 127.1


    A lot of people use this when dedicating a church or building.

    But it's really about the house of David, according to my Hermeneutics prof. I'm going by memory - can't recall how he explained it.
     
  10. Marcia

    Marcia
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    11,139
    Likes Received:
    0
    Another one:

    Without a vision, the people perish Prov. 28.18

    A lot of people even use this in secular ways as though it's about having a "vision" or goal. But the actual word is closer to "revelation" and specifically, "revelation" of God's law.

    The whole verse states:
    Where there is no vision, the people perish: but he that keepeth the law, happy is he.
     
  11. blackbird

    blackbird
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2002
    Messages:
    11,898
    Likes Received:
    2
    The "vision" is the Lord Jesus Christ------------you can carry this verse over to the New Testament-----------and can see where the verse becomes a reality in John 1:14, "And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, glory as of the only begotten of the Father"

    And then to the group of Greeks desiring "to see" Jesus

    Without a vision the people perish--------they indeed do
     
  12. annsni

    annsni
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2006
    Messages:
    20,190
    Likes Received:
    373
    Of course there's the classic verse that ALL non-Christians use when Christians dare to say something is a sin: "Judge not lest ye be judged" Why do people who don't believe the Bible is anything more than a book quote this one? OY!! I had it tossed to me last week by a pagan. LOL
     
  13. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Speaking of using verses out of context ...

    This verse has nothing to do with Jesus. In its context, it is about the law.
     
  14. ktn4eg

    ktn4eg
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2004
    Messages:
    3,517
    Likes Received:
    1
    "For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end." -- Jeremiah 29:11

    Time after time I've heard this verse preached as an encouragement to an individual or a group of Christians starting out on some new venture or phase of their lives (e.g., graduation, marriage, off to college, going off on a mission tour, etc.) .

    Now, I won't deny the fact that God certainly does have "thoughts of peace" toward His NT people--be they an individual or a group, but that verse is taken woefully out of context if it's applied in such cases as it usually is.

    Look at verses 1 through 4 of Jeremiah 29 to see exactly to whom that passage is addressed. Verse 4 couldn't be more direct in telling us that it's addressed to the Jews "whom I have caused to be carried away from Jerusalem (i.e., the remaining "Southern Kingdom" a/k/a Judah) unto Babylon."

    And what exactly does God (through the prophet Jeremiah) tell them to do? Well, verses 5-7 pretty well tells them what He wants them to do, especially verse 7 ("And seek the peace of the city whither I have caused you to be carried away captives, and pray unto the LORD for it; for in the peace thereof shall ye have peace.")

    Does this passage in Jeremiah 29:1-11ff have any application to us today?

    Well, it could very likely have an application, but not in the sense that 29:11 is normally preached.

    Jesus in Luke 19:13 told those who were thinking "that the kingdom of God should immediately appear" (19:11) when Jesus would enter Jerusalem to "Occupy till I come."

    And just exactly what did Jesus mean by "occupying"?

    Strong's Concordance points out that the verb "occupy" (#4231) means "to busy oneself with "business, matter, thing, work" (#4229). Our English word "pragmatic" comes this same Greek word.

    With what business did Jesus tell His people to be occupied?

    We could start off with the Great Comission, couldn't we? We could add what Acts 1:8 tells us to do, couldn't we?

    Then, after that we could go on to other things that the NT tells us to do(e.g., "Husbands love your wives"; "Children obey your parents"; "Be not weary in well doing"; "Pray without ceasing," "Study to show thyself approved" etc., etc.), couldn't we?

    Back to the Jeremiah 29 passage. Basically God was telling His OT people that, yes, after 70 years, you're going home, but in the meantime, build houses, have children and let your children marry as well because you're going to be in Babylon a long time--fourscore and ten years to be exact.

    Fourscore and ten years is about as old as most OT people lived.

    My point--for all of your life (or at least as long as you've been saved) God wants you to be occupied with whatever He has commanded you to do "till I come."

    For some that may mean being a preacher/pastor or missionary or an evangelist. For most Christians, however, that'll mean other vocations or callings. If God has called you to be a mechanic or an office manager or trucker or "whatever," then "occupy" for Jesus till He comes.

    If God has planted you in your neighborhood (be that "in the projects" or "on millionaires' row") "occupy" for Jesus till He comes.

    And, if you are faithful in "occupying" where the Lord has "carried" you, what can you expect to happen?

    "Then shall ye call upon me, and ye shall go and pray unto me, and I will heaken unto to you. And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart. And I will be found of you, saith the LORD" (Jeremiah 29:12-14a [emphasis mine])!!
     
  15. gb93433

    gb93433
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2003
    Messages:
    15,496
    Likes Received:
    6
    It is very common for Phil 1:6 to be lifted from its context of the standard form of a letter during that day--a prayer of thanksgiving and/or Intercession.
     
  16. sag38

    sag38
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    4,394
    Likes Received:
    1
    I am but one Chiristian and indwelt by the Holy Spirit. So where I am whether it be with two or three other Christians, by myself, or in a football stadium full of pagan, Christ is there.
     
  17. Amy.G

    Amy.G
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Isa 53:5 But he [was] wounded for our transgressions, [he was] bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace [was] upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

    A lot of people call on this verse to claim physical healing.

    This whole passage of scripture is about the spiritual healing that Christ will give when He is crucified and takes our sins upon Himself. I see nothing about the physical healing of disease.
     
  18. webdog

    webdog
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,691
    Likes Received:
    0
    "look not upon the wine while it is red" is the classic "proof text" for the avoidance of all alcohol...out of context, of course.
     
  19. gb93433

    gb93433
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2003
    Messages:
    15,496
    Likes Received:
    6
    One with God is a majority.
     
  20. rbell

    rbell
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Whenever I see people use scripture out of context, I am reminded of the verse,























    :D
     

Share This Page

Loading...