Was Man Created Mortal?

HP: I agree that such should be one of our goals, but that in no wise negates the point the author is making, i.e., the things that are seen are temporal, and eternal things cannot be seen with physical eyes. Certainly I could say that I see you and you are going to live eternally, but what will live on will not be what I can see with my physical eyes. That will decay and must be changed in order to inhabit eternity.

HP: Paul neither suggests any such thing nor is such a conclusion logical in the least. Pain IS an effect of a physical cause or a mental state related to a physical world. Pain whether directly physical or a result of mental anguish due to events, attitudes, etc. in this physical world will cease to be painful according to Scripture as we enter the realm of eternity in a spiritual world.

No one has stated or implied, nor has any argument I have made necessitate the idea, that if you cannot see something it must be eternal. That is a ludicrous notion that has no place in our discussion. If that was true, a blind man would not live in a physical world, now would he? Paul was expressing that the physical things that exist in this world will indeed perish, and the things that will exist in eternity are not physical nor can they be. You may be able to see a manifestation of spiritual things with ones physical eyes, but that does not negate the fact that they are not in actuality physical as we know it. Even if they are manifested as physical in some sense, it is but for a temporal moment of time.

HPHK has suggested that because some things cannot be seen, such as electricity or wind, they must of necessity be eternal if what he terms as ‘my theory’ is correct. Such comments have absolutely no merit. He suggests something that I have neither stated nor in any way is implied by anything I have said. Because there are realities in this world I cannot or have not seen, does not mean they are of necessity eternal in nature. The individual in the next room I may never see, but that does not negate the fact that that unseen body of the individual in the next room is some how eternal because I have not or cannot see it. There are numerous such cases of similar instances or the contemplation of phenomena like the wind that cannot be seen with physical eyes, but can be felt by other physical senses, but in fact are part and parcel to this temporal world and as such are not eternal realities as we know them. That in no way takes away from or negates the truth that I have repeated by the apostle Paul that things which are seen are eternal and the things which are eternal cannot be seen. DHK would try to confuse the listener into believing that if there are things that can be seen ‘in some sense’ that are eternal, or there are some things ‘in some sense that cannot be seen that are temporal, that such negates the clear fact that things which are seen are temporal, and things which are not seen are eternal, and that as an absolute reality. Such conclusions are simply wrong. Let me illustrate.

Angels are spiritual beings. They can manifest themselves in a physical world that can be seen with physical eyes, but that does not negate the fact that they are not physical but spiritual beings. We cannot see them with our physical eyes 'unless' they manifest themselves in physical reality. Just the same, it can be said that such a physical manifestation is indeed temporal although the object itself, in reality, is eternal. Because we can see them in certain instances, does this negate the fact that as spiritual beings they cannot be seen with physical eyes? By no means. Cannot it be stated absolutely that angels are spiritual and as such cannot be seen by physical eyes in that state. Yet in another sense, or in some temporal state, be able to be seen with physical eyes, or at least physical eyes can indeed see the temporal manifestation of an eternal reality that in its normal state could not be seen with physical eyes?

I have no 'theory,' I am simply quoting Scripture. It is DHK that is trying to somehow contort the obvious to obfuscate the truth that everything that we know and see in this physical world as a physical reality will indeed perish with a fervent heat. Anything and everything now seen or realized as physical will have to undergo a change to survive eternally. The physical as we know it is temporal and cannot, according to Scripture, inherit the spiritual world to come.

For DHK to imply that because there are some things that cannot be seen that are indeed physical, and that somehow diminishes the truth the apostle clearly expressed or the statement that I have made, is simply ludicrous. A blind man again would laugh at such nonsense. I have neither suggested or implied that the apostle was suggesting that there are not some things ‘in some sense’ that cannot be seen and yet are physical, or that there are some eternal realities ‘in some sense’ that can be seen to one degree or another by physical eyes, such as the angels manifested in the flesh etc. Just the same, I believe it can be stated as Scripture clearly does, that the physical world with all its effects will indeed cease when the physical world as we know it is dissolved with a fervent heat. Of a truth, it can be said with clarity that the things which are seen are temporal, while the things which cannot be seen are eternal without drawing any of the false implications DHK suggests.