We've done this, I truly believe. I read the threads about women preaching, or about creation, or arminian vs calvinist teaching, and I think we have drunk from the Roman pool. I know this will offend some of the landmark line--I used to be one. But the church is composed of the believers. It doesn't necessarily meet at your sanctuary. You don't run it, control it, call its' leaders or decide its teachings. In the light of eternity your degrees (though perhaps useful) are meaningless. Your ceremonies do not determine anyone's eternal destiny. Everywhere believers go is "the church." The preaching, praying, singing, and teaching that go on outside your walls is just as valid--maybe more so--than what goes on inside them. When did we decide we as a group get to set dogma? How different is the concept of the BFM from RCC dogma? Really? If we believe the only valid baptism is "our" baptism, how do we differ from the RCC? If we view our clergy as set apart and special, a prized group most are not privy to enter and without who's presence and blessing you do not have real church, have we not made them priests? I believe God fulfilled and set aside ritual Judaism, replacing it with the church. (Practically speaking, not necessarily theologically speaking. Let's not go there in this thread.) I don't believe we currently are called to make blood sacrifices on an altar in Jerusalem. There may have been a time God spoke through the RCC or what became the RCC. However, when ritual became the end all be all instead of Jesus Christ, He gave the Reformation. And now we in the church commonly called Protestant (and I agree we may not truly be "protestants") are as judaizing as any Pharisee and as ritualized as any in the RCC. And shame on us: if we continue down this road, we may have the blessed privilege of carrying the gospel ripped from OUR hands also. I see it starting now: many wonderful preachers, men and women of God, effectively bringing lost souls to the Savior. Some teach public school. Some sing country and western music. Some raise babies--their own and those of others. Some sell used cars. Some peddle insurance. What they have in common is a disdain for the "organized church." And God forgive us, sometimes when we church folk debate here or out in the world, I cannot blame them.