What can I learn about Individual Growth, Evangelism and Church Growth...

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Joseph_Botwinick, Jul 13, 2005.

  1. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick
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    in Rick Warren's book, The Purpose Driven Life, that I cannot learn in the Bible?

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  2. blackbird

    blackbird
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    Nothin'!!!

    I believe that Warren's book is a "fad"---the latest among many including the Jabez series, Tribulation Force, etc.----people want to study---but they want to do it for nothin'!!! They want to let somebody else "dig" the gold---and then get in on the reapin'!!!

    Just my opinion!!

    I'm not gonna preach nothin' but "The Book"---The Good Book, that is----God's Holy word from the Word!!
     
  3. All about Grace

    All about Grace
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    I could use the same argument for preaching itself. Your logic makes no sense.
     
  4. Grasshopper

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    Exactly. I have seen pastors on this board basically call commentaries "worthless". All they need is the Bible! Yet they also want their local church to hand them over a paycheck once a month so they can continue to recieve the pastor's sermon/commentary of the Bible.

    I don't think this is the point that Joseph is trying to make. I think what the question is, Is Warren's book saying anything other than what can be found by just a casual reading of the Bible? I haven't read Warren's book, but I would be interested in the opinions of those who have.
     
  5. Pastor Larry

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    A book like Warren's has the benefits of a systematic theology. I disagree with some of his points, but basically what he has done is taken everything the Bible has to say about a subject, put it in one place, and added soem commentary. Some of its good; some of its bad. But you won't get it by a "casual reading" of the Bible. You would get it by in depth Bible study (the good part of it that is).
     
  6. blackbird

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    Sorry guys---but the book just doesn't float my ship!!! Nothing against Warren---he's a good guy---not the greatest expositor I've ever heard---nor is he the greatest pulpiteer-----but let me ask a couple of questions

    Do any of you suppose that Warren had any inkling of an idea that his book would "take off" like it did??----if I had to guess---I would say no!

    Reckon how Warren feels that he knows(and surely he knows---he ain't an idiot---he may have been born at nite--but it wasn't last nite!!) that many, many pastors and laypeople are preaching "PDL"----some practically verbatum and are hinceforth not preaching the word??

    Obviously---the book isn't for every church----if your church is a "Chevrolet" church---and Warren's book is a repair manuel for "FORD"----guess what????

    I don't have no beef with Warren---he's cool---just beefin' it up with preachers who "flock" to the bookstore thinkin' that PDL is a cure-all!!!
     
  7. PastorSBC1303

    PastorSBC1303
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    [​IMG] That is the understatement of the year!
     
  8. donnA

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    [​IMG] That is the understatement of the year! </font>[/QUOTE]So which one of the pastors on here is.
     
  9. PastorSBC1303

    PastorSBC1303
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    There are a lot of great expositors out there today. Warren is not one of them. I am not discrediting his ministry. He has done a lot of good. He just isn't an expositor.
     
  10. TaterTot

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    I have heard him speak, too, and expository preaching isnt his forte. But he is very relational and has some great gifts.
     
  11. blackbird

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    [​IMG] That is the understatement of the year! </font>[/QUOTE]So which one of the pastors on here is. </font>[/QUOTE]I am in constant confessing and repenting of the sin of not being the best expositor I can be. [​IMG]
     
  12. patrick

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    Warrem is more of a communicator. He is very topical. That really isn't my forte. He is theologicly sound in his teaching.
     
  13. All about Grace

    All about Grace
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    Warren does not want to be known as an expository preacher. That does not make him any less of a preacher or any less committed to biblical truth. He simply prefes a different method of preaching.
     
  14. Joseph_Botwinick

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    What can I learn about individual growth, evangelism and church growth from reading the PDL that I cannot learn from reading the Bible?

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  15. patrick

    patrick
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    Joseph,

    Do you read devotions? Your logical conclusion we just need to Read the Bible and burn our libary of books. Dont' watch the newa becuse that takes away time from the Bible.
     
  16. LarryN

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    Joseph, I think you may be asking more of PDL than Warren intended it to deliver.

    PDL covers individual growth, and in terms of evangelism it deals with it on the scale of personal evangelism.

    Warren's earlier book, The Purpose Driven Church, deals with evangelism less on a personal scale, and more on the scale of the local church & beyond. PDC would also cover church growth.

    So I don't think you'll find the three things you inquire about all in PDL necessarily. But when you look at both of Warren's books, you'd find coverage of all three topics.
     
  17. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Patrick,

    I read the Bible every day. The news argument is just plain ole silly, since I don't watch the news in order to learn about spiritual growth. I watch the news to keep up with what is going on in the world as a citizen in the world. However, on the other hand, I see many Churches using the PDL for individual growth, evangelism, and church growth. That leads me to wonder what we learn from the PDL about individual growth, evangelism, and church growth that we cannot learn in the Bible. Can you answer my question?

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  18. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Joseph, I think you may be asking more of PDL than Warren intended it to deliver.

    PDL covers individual growth, and in terms of evangelism it deals with it on the scale of personal evangelism.

    Warren's earlier book, The Purpose Driven Church, deals with evangelism less on a personal scale, and more on the scale of the local church & beyond. PDC would also cover church growth.

    So I don't think you'll find the three things you inquire about all in PDL necessarily. But when you look at both of Warren's books, you'd find coverage of all three topics.
    </font>[/QUOTE]The latter book is built on the foundation of the first. I have read both books, BTW. What can I learn from the PDC about Church Growth, Evangelism, and Individual Growth that I cannot learn from the Bible?

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  19. LarryN

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    You won't learn anything different than what the Bible has to teach. And if the books did present anything as being new or different from what the Bible teaches, that should be your cue to close them up & toss them out.

    But that's not exactly the point of Warren's book, nor is it the point of any other pastor who's written books on any Biblical topic. Let's not forget that books on individual growth, evangelism, or church growth aren't a recent innovation. I'm thinking of books like Jack Hyles' 1962 book Let's Build an Evangelistic Church as just one example (and that book covers all three topics).

    So why do folks write such books? I think it's to provide practical examples & insights into how to actually do what the Bible teaches & commands. For example, read the Great Commission:

    (KJV) Matt. 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

    So how does one actually best go about doing that? In regards to effective evangelism, I'm grateful for the opportunity to read about & learn from what works for someone else. God's Word doesn't say that we all have to be "Lone Rangers" or figure out how to "reinvent the wheel" in living as a Christian.
     
  20. Joseph_Botwinick

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    I have always felt that the book of Acts and the ministry of Paul gave us a good example of how to put the Great Commission into practice. But, maybe Jack Hyles and Rick Warren have more wisdom than what we can find in the Bible? :confused:


    Also, are you saying the Bible is simply a theory book which needs Rick Warren and Jack Hyles to give it practical application for today? Is the Bible not practical?

    Joseph Botwinick
     

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