What do you do when you find out.........

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by 10usNE1, Feb 5, 2002.

  1. 10usNE1

    10usNE1
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    that the pastor of your church, the man who probably was the most influential in your life, other than your family, has been arrested, charged with multiple counts of sexual assault with minors, specifically most of them his grandchildren?

    How does one keep from renouncing Christianity?

    What does the church do that he pastored? The name of the church has been in the news paper, and on the TV news. How does the church as a whole handle this? BTW, he no longer pastors the church, he retired 9 years ago. The man is 71 years old and the reports have said that some of the assaults happened inside the church.
     
  2. Jonathan

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 10usNE1:
    that the pastor of your church, the man who probably was the most influential in your life, other than your family, has been arrested, charged with multiple counts of sexual assault with minors, specifically most of them his grandchildren?

    How does one keep from renouncing Christianity?

    What does the church do that he pastored? The name of the church has been in the news paper, and on the TV news. How does the church as a whole handle this? BTW, he no longer pastors the church, he retired 9 years ago. The man is 71 years old and the reports have said that some of the assaults happened inside the church.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I cannot begin to understand the frustration that you are feeling about this. In this regard, I will place your situation in the same category as the events of 9/11. As the result of both instances, you should be able to say two things:

    1) You have learned nothing new about man.
    2) You have learned nothing new about God.

    That depravity has entered a church body should not be a surprise to you. Shocking yes, surprising, no.

    Note that if you are willing to give up your faith over this issue, you may need to be reacquainted with the true foundation of faith.

    My prayers are with you, your family, and church body.
     
  3. JAMES2

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    The first thing I would do is not jump conclusions and think he is guilty because he has been arrested. You can arrest anyone for anything, and it happens all the time.

    If, after a trial he is found guilty, then you get a new pastor. People have to understand the fallen nature of man. Paul went around killing people.

    Your salvation depends on God regenerating you, giving you the gift of faith and on Christ's finished work on the cross. Your salvation or faith does not come from any other source.

    Pray that justice is done and wait for the truth to be determined before you condemn the man. Remember, we are all guilty and if we got what we deserved we would all be in hell. Thank God for his mercy.
    James2
     
  4. tyndale1946

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    Why would you renounce Christianity? We are commanded by Jesus to follow him and not a man! To many people in various religions follow the man instead of the message. Men fall they always do they are not perfect but the minister that falls answers to God!

    I have been in the church almost all my life of 55 years and I always followed Christ not any one man! Men are prone to stumble as they are not perfect and when they do they usually take many who have been following them with them even though they were in error.

    The people that follow them can't believe what had happened was true and that it's just the Devil trying to break up the church.
    I've seen churches split right down the middle because the members didn't follow the rules set down in the bible.

    If the evidence is there get rid of that person that brought the problems upon the church. He may be a minister but he is also a member and should be treated as such. You need to follow Christ and him alone! The scriptures state Follow me as I follow Christ and the reverse applies also If I don't follw Christ don't follow me! I hope you find a church that is following Christ and him only!... God Bless You My Christian Friend... Brother Glen [​IMG]
     
  5. 10usNE1

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    Please pray for this church. My husband pastored the church right after this man. We were at the church for 8 years. My husband resigned the church last September. The pastor they have now has only been on the field for a month. We have many friends at the church that have been profoundly affected by this. My heart breaks for the people that grew up under this man's pastorate.

    Cindy
     
  6. Gina B

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 10usNE1:
    that the pastor of your church, the man who probably was the most influential in your life, other than your family, has been arrested, charged with multiple counts of sexual assault with minors, specifically most of them his grandchildren?

    How does one keep from renouncing Christianity?

    What does the church do that he pastored? The name of the church has been in the news paper, and on the TV news. How does the church as a whole handle this? BTW, he no longer pastors the church, he retired 9 years ago. The man is 71 years old and the reports have said that some of the assaults happened inside the church.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    If the charges do turn out to be accurate.
    First, by recognizing that although this man claimed and was supposed to be a representative of Jesus Christ, he was still a man and still human, and capable of sin.
    Place the blame on the appropriate person. Recognize that it was not Christ who caused this pain, it was a man through his sin.
    Learn more about sexual abusers, about their mindset and what causes them to abuse, not so that you can excuse them, not at all, but so that you can begin to understand them. This a major step toward healing and forgiveness, even if you were not the direct victim of the abuse, it still affected you directly. Start on this process immediately before bitterness has a chance to set in and become out of control.
    The need for the church members to stick together needs to be addressed. They will also want to if they see the need for it and see that they can help each other through this. I would even suggest having special meetings for those who were under this man's pastorate to be able to get together and discuss what they're going through, supporting each other through this, and the extra support may help everyone not to lose faith.
    Gina
     
  7. Danette

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    Unfortunately, this is not an isolated incident. I'm glad that somebody was willing to come forward and make an issue of it, assuming that it's true. There are a lot of churches where "for the sake of the ministry" such behavior is swept under the rug. I know this from close personal experience! And it's one of the few things that really gets my hackles up!!!

    As everyone else has said, times like this challenge what we really believe in. Are we following a man or God? Yes, it is absolutely devastating to those whose lives have been touched by it. But God is bigger than that, too. He can even use that for His glory.

    I work with a Christian women's website and we've devoted an entire section to this very issue because several of us have experienced it up close and personal. If you're interested, you can check in out at Titus 2 Women

    The section is called, "Child Abuse -- It Happens!" The next part of the section, "Affects of Abuse" was just finished in the past couple days and isn't up yet, but there's already a TON of great info there.

    -- Danette
     
  8. Chris Temple

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 10usNE1:
    that the pastor of your church, the man who probably was the most influential in your life, other than your family, has been arrested, charged with multiple counts of sexual assault with minors, specifically most of them his grandchildren?

    How does one keep from renouncing Christianity?

    What does the church do that he pastored? The name of the church has been in the news paper, and on the TV news. How does the church as a whole handle this? BTW, he no longer pastors the church, he retired 9 years ago. The man is 71 years old and the reports have said that some of the assaults happened inside the church.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I see he has been charged and accused, but not yet tried and convicted. Remember, a man is innocent until proven guilty.
     
  9. Grace

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    I will pray for this church family. I will also pray for this pastor and his family. Remember that God is in control of all, and God knows the whole story, not just what we hear.
     
  10. Aaron

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    I agree with Jonathan. It sounds as if you have put your faith in a man and not in Christ.

    Man will always fail you. Christ never will.
     
  11. 10usNE1

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    Ok men let's see now....I know exactly what you are saying about not putting your faith in a man, and I agree to a certain degree, but we are talking about a pastor, an overseer of the flock of Jesus. This man was at the church for 18 years. During that time he counseled, advised, admonished, and I dare say that the flock, at least some of them, took that counsel, advise and admonishment. So, yes, to a certain degree they were putting their faith and trust in this man.

    Cindy
     
  12. aiki

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    There's no pretending this man hasn't done harm to the reputation of your church and perhaps Christianity generally. I believe both will survive.

    As I read this thread that hymn went through my mind...let me see... how does it go?

    Turn your eyes upon Jesus,
    Look full in his wonderful face,
    And the the things of earth will grow strangely dim,
    In the light of his glory and grace.

    As others have said, when we stop "looking unto Jesus" (Heb. 12:2) our faith, like Peter's, will begin to waver.

    By the way, I hope that someone is seeking to restore this man to fellowship. God's view of sin isn't vertical, but horizontal. There aren't really bad sins at the top of his list and lesser sins lower down. God detests a proud look as much as murder. (Prov. 6:17) So, no one can look upon this man as worse than themself (James 2:10). Just as we all do, this man needs forgiveness and the support of christian brothers and sisters. (Gal. 6:1)

    God bless.

    [ February 06, 2002: Message edited by: aiki ]
     
  13. Wester

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    Assume that he is innocent until a court decides otherwise. There have been many instances of wrongful accusations in these situations.
     
  14. SaggyWoman

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    I am not saying he is guilty, but there also have been as many times where molestation has taken place and nothing has been said or done.
     
  15. TaterTot

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    My husband is a pastor too, and we have dealt with a similar situation as well. Before he was pastoring but was on staff, my husband found evidence of an affair between the sec. and pastor of 15 years. Pastors son was my husband's best friend. It was a terrible situation. About 8 years later, the community still feels the pain. Its a terrible lesson to learn about the nature of man and it just reiterates that no one is exempt from sin and temptation. Healing will come if the people allow it, but the repercussions may be there quite a while. I am so sorry for this congregation you are talking about in the original post and my prayers are with them.
    TaterTot
     
  16. Jonathan

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 10usNE1:
    Ok men let's see now....I know exactly what you are saying about not putting your faith in a man, and I agree to a certain degree, but we are talking about a pastor, an overseer of the flock of Jesus. This man was at the church for 18 years. During that time he counseled, advised, admonished, and I dare say that the flock, at least some of them, took that counsel, advise and admonishment. So, yes, to a certain degree they were putting their faith and trust in this man.

    Cindy
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Each member has the responsibility to take all counsel, advice, admonishment, and all other instructions back to the Word for confirmation. If this was done during the past 18 years, then folks were not placing their faith in a man. However, if, as is all too common in our churches, folks simply took the words of this man as gospel then your are correct, they did place their faith in a man.
     
  17. Danette

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    I have been thinking about this for the past two days since I first saw the thread and haven't been able to get it off my mind. None of the answers any of us have given so far (myself included) really address the heart of the questions asked. But it's not something that can adequately be addressed in a dialogue box because of it's inherent length. It would take up a huge amount of space!

    After some sleeplessness last night, I have attempted to really answer the questions asked. For the sake of ease (not clogging up space on the BB) I have uploaded it onto the internet. It is not actually on a website, so it is not publicly visible. Here's the URL:

    What do you do?

    I hope this will help!

    -- Danette
     

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