What does "in" mean?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by billwald, May 26, 2012.

  1. billwald

    billwald
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    From another thread, "Not all of Adam's sons that were born and created IN ADAM are listed here. "

    Are you all created "in" your fathers and mothers? "In" your grandparents and great grandparents?
     
  2. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    The term "in" can mean a variety of things depending upon the context. However, in regard to reproduction after ones own kind and in the case of the human specie it refers to the restricted source or origin of the human race with Adam as the first of this kind.
     
  3. billwald

    billwald
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    Then that settles the "Cain" thread.
     
  4. The Biblicist

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    yep!

    Here is a question for SBM:

    If one in the linage of Adam marries one in the lineage of Cain and have children together, then which lineage are their children? Wouldn't that make the children half human and half non-human or half created in the image of God and half created in the image of Satan?
     
  5. Tom Butler

    Tom Butler
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    I'm confused.

    Isn't Cain in the lineage of Adam?

    Who says the children of Cain are half-human and half non-human?

    Who says Cain was created in the image of Satan?

    Where do we find this in scripture?
     
  6. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    Tom,

    Just go to the thread "What about Cain" by SBM and read the first three pages and you will see where all this is coming from.

    SBM denies Cain is found in the geneology of Adam simply because his name is not mentioned in chapter five. He claims that Cain was not made in the image of God. He claims that death and sin in the line of Cain did not originate with Adam's sin but directly with Satan. He claims that Cain's descendents are the non-elect while Adam's descendants are the elect and so on and so forth.
     
  7. Yeshua1

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    is the the '2 seed" theory, that satan had sex with eve, and that line produced demon seeds?

    that is pure "baloney", as NO verses support that ANY human EVER born was NOT of the race/line of adam!
     
  8. savedbymercy

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    Cain was not created in Adam ! He was not Adam and Eves Seed. Abel was and then Seth took his place Gen 4:25

    And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.

    Cain was out of the wicked one 1 Jn 3:12

    12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

    However, cain was Adam and Eve's biological son and Abel's biological brother !
     
  9. mandym

    mandym
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    Good grief! The stupid things that come out on this board.
     
  10. evangelist-7

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    Since "in" and "upon" mean the same thing (according to Baptists and others)
    why doesn't the thread title say, "What does "in/upon" mean?
    IMO, this would be much more accurate, and would be better received.
    .
     
  11. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    Well not even the Elect are born in the Image of God by nature, the Transgression of Adam foiled that, That Image is restored now only by a New Creation, a New Man as Per Col 3:10

    And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

    Yes, Let me make it clear, The natural man is not born as Adam was Created in the image and Likeness of God ! The Natural man is born Darkness , even the Elect, Paul says to them Eph 5:8

    For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:

    Not in darkness, which was true as well, but we were darkness, we were just like the children of darkness 1 Thess 5:5

    Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not[Children] of the night, nor of darkness.
     
  12. The Biblicist

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    So bottom line your distinction between the seed of cain and the seed of the woman makes no difference at all because they are so interbred that one cannot be distinguished from the other and only new birth is your final solution.
     
  13. savedbymercy

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    Yes the New Birth will manifest The Children of God from the children of the devil 1 Jn 3:9-10

    9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

    10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

    The word manifest means :

    ) apparent, manifest, evident, known

    2) manifest i.e to be plainly recognised or known

    Before being born of God, The Elect are just as deceived as the children of the devil !

    Titus 3:3

    For we[The Elect] ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

    But the New Birth undeceives us with belief unto the Truth !
     
  14. HankD

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    All mankind is made in His image.​

    Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.​

    HankD​
     
  15. savedbymercy

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    That applies to the Elect. They were made in the Image of God in Adam, and when they are born again that Image is Restored !

    Man since sin is born as darkness and by nature children of wrath. Nothing about us by nature is in the image of God . That Image is restored in Regeneration

    Col 3:10

    And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

    Now that being the case its quite clear that before the renewal we are not in the image of Him that created us !
     
    #15 savedbymercy, May 29, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: May 29, 2012
  16. HankD

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    Hi SBM,

    I don't see the smallest suggestion that Genesis 9:5-6 speaks only of the elect.

    Genesis 9
    5 And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man.
    6 Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.​

    RE Colossians 3:10 "renewed in knowledge".

    James 3:9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.​


    HankD
     
    #16 HankD, May 30, 2012
    Last edited: May 30, 2012
  17. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    hank

    I cannot help what you do not see. I have given you the basis of why it must be so ! The bible is clear that man lost his image of God if indeed it is restored when he is a new man Col 3:10

    10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

    Are you suggesting that the old man is after the image of God also ? I do not believe you can find support for that if you do.

    This world in the beginning was made for God's Elect, so its government is primarily for their Good ! That did not change !
     
  18. HankD

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    Obviously we disagree. I do not believe that your view is what Colossians 3:10 presents.

    The image is still there and is "renewed in knowledge.

    First it is not "restored" in the sense that it was destroyed as you have said but "renewed in knowledge".

    No doubt there is a disconnect of knowledge concerning the things of God and those who are lost, yet they remain the image of God though they are dead toward God.

    My position is that "in knowledge" would have been left out of the passage if it were according to your view.

    The new birth is a renewal of that connection with our intellect and will.

    The Genesis 9 passage makes no such distinction of whose blood will be shed, by whom it will be shed and the reason why it must be shed.

    Genesis 9:6 Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.​

    Neither does the James 3:8-9 passage make a distinction as to "elect" or "lost" concerning those who are made in the similitude of God.

    James 3
    8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
    9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.​

    Now you may make that distinction and perhaps it is a proper distinction for these passages.

    Nonetheless these passages in and of themselves do not make that distinction but lend themselves to the position that I have chosen as to their reality (that there is no distinction made).

    Perhaps the rub is that we as Christians must therefore treat the lost with the required respect indicated by the scripture that though they are dead in trespasses and sins they remain in the image of God and we therefore have no right to "curse" them.​

    Personally I am persuaded that this fact of being His image bearers constituted a large part of the counsel of God resulting in the decree of salvation toward the human race - that we are all according to His image and likeness.​

    HankD
     
  19. savedbymercy

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    hank

    Thats fine !
     
  20. HankD

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    Thanks.

    HankD
     

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