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Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by nunatak, Aug 21, 2008.
What do you think?
It means I am in Covenant with Him...because He said so. :laugh:
I think everybody has a relationship with Christ.
A relationship of redemption,
Or a relationship of wrath.
I don't call it a covenant, though. :wavey:
A relationship with Christ results when you believe in Him (faith), and are thereby reconciled to God (which means His wrath on you is removed). Of course, it means more than, but I'm keeping it short.
What does it mean to have a relationship with Jesus?
Why not? God calls it a Covenant. The New Covenant to be exact.
I don't deny there is a new covenant, I just don't think of that way. I think in terms of being saved and redeemed, given eternal life, etc., although I realize I am included in the new covenant. I just don't use that phrase - maybe because I don't normally hear people around me saying, "I'm in a new covenant." Usually, they say, "I'm saved" or "I have a relationship with Christ."
I disagree that the relationship begins (results) at the moment of faith. Scripture teaches the relationship began in "eternity past" (before the foundation of the world) when we were known by God, elected, predestined and so forth, based entirely on the will of God and not according to anything we will do in the future.
We may very well realize our relationship with Him at the moment of faith. You are certainly correct that the relationship is the result of the reconciling work of Christ on the cross.
And, of course, you are most certainly correct in saying it means much more. More, even than we realize or can give a voice to.
To have a relationship with Jesus is to be known by God in an intimate fellowship, having Holy Spirit indwelling to guide and to intercede, and Jesus as the object of our faith and hope.
peace to youraying:
I believe that a relationship with Christ, also called abiding in Him in the Bible, does begin when we accept Him as our Lord and Savior. It's not something that is only defined at that one point in time, however. It continues throughout our Christian walk if our salvation experience was genuine.
So you think a relationship with Christ is abiding in Him.
Abiding in Christ begins with conversion, but continues throughout our lives.
How would you say it continues? Is this abiding relationship unique to each believer?
Actually, I bet y'all say it more than you think. Probably every time you take the Lord's Table together and read the Scriptures, "This is the New Covenant in my blood."
I don't think I can improve on Jesus' description of abiding in Him in the Book of John.
Jhn 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Jhn 15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Jhn 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.
Jhn 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
Jhn 15:8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
Jhn 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
Jhn 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
Jhn 15:11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and [that] your joy might be full.
Jhn 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
What is called "abiding in Him" here is the same as having a close ongoing relationship with Jesus Christ. As Jesus says here it entails keeping His commandments, bearing fruit, and loving one another. Those who do not have this ongoing relationship with Christ do not bear fruit and "men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned."
It's all right here in Jesus' words in the Bible.
Then you believe that a relationship with Christ is the same as keeping his commandments?
And it is not unique to each believer?
If one believes in Jesus, then that is the beginning of a relationship, that of one having faith, and the other being the object of his faith. This relationship will grow and develop just like relationships between children and parents, and husbands and wives.
So the question, "What does it mean to have a relationship with Jesus," is too broad to answer in a concise post. Pick one aspect of this relationship. Something like, "What does it mean to believe the Message?"
So, the relationship begins with faith in Christ?
Then it becomes something broad that we can't speak to as believers in a detailed fashion?
Then how can I know my relationship is biblical?
A saving relationship, yes. Everyone saved or not has a relationship with Christ as his Creator, Benefactor, Ruler and Judge.
You're not paying attention. I said your question was too broad to answer with a concise post.
The first requirement is to know your Bible.
No, I was paying attention.
So can you give me some bullet points as to what a relationship with Christ means after saving faith? Maybe 4 or 5? Or, do you believe a relationship is something that can not be examined in a detailed fashion?
BINGO!! It means BROTHER with Christ and SON of God.
We have a choice of what kind of relationship we have with Christ. Believers try to follow Christ and become his disciples. We will stumble and fall many times but Christ will always be there with his unconditional love to help us up. We will fail many, many times but Christ will never fail us.
Unbelievers choose to have a very poor relationship with Christ. They cannot even say that they did not know because Jesus says, "I am the way, the truth and the life; no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."
No. As Jesus says here it entails keeping His commandments, bearing fruit, and loving one another. Since every believer is an individual, their relationship with Christ would be somewhat different but within these boundaries.