What Happened to the Hopes of 1994?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by KenH, Jul 30, 2005.

  1. KenH

    KenH
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    "In 1994, the central state was seen by the bourgeoisie as the main threat to the family; in 2004 it is seen as the main tool for keeping the family together and ensuring its ascendancy. In 1994, the state was seen as the enemy of education; today, the same people view the state as the means of raising standards and purging education of its left-wing influences. In 1994, Christians widely saw that Leviathan was the main enemy of the faith; today, they see Leviathan as the tool by which they will guarantee that their faith will have an impact on the country and the world."

    - rest at SOURCE

    Rhetorically a bit over the top in my view but a good read.
     
  2. church mouse guy

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    That article is Christmas of last year.

    I disagree with the Libertarians along several lines.

    First, the contract with America elected many Republicans and all of the issues of the contract were dealt with one way or another. However, the leader of that movement is gone forever.

    Secondly, the failed impeachment of Clinton is a tribute to his intellectual abilities and not an acceptance of his failings. If Clinton had not been so timid militarily that he relied solely on air power, he might have been great.

    Thirdly, and this is the reason most often missed by Libertarians and the far right is that liberalism has been hard to dislodge. I thought 20 years ago that we were seeing the end of liberalism. However, Reagan rightly defined it as the Iron Triangle (a reference to an area of military difficulty in Viet Nam) of the educational industry, the media industry, and the government worker industry. Those sectors of the economy have grown rich and powerful since FDR and they do not go quietly. Liberalism itself is based upon wealth, which means power.

    And lastly, Libertarians and the far right have not been good allies of the GOP but more often than not have fought on the Democrat side of issues. The Libertarians mention the military, but we can conclude that they and the far right are openly against the war, calling it illegal and calling for US capitulation and withdrawal no matter what. More importantly, the GOP has been in the wilderness for 70 years. I know because my grandparents and parents were life-long Republicans. The Democrats even swept over Indiana during the Depression under FDR. The Democrats ruled Washington DC and the USA from 1932 until the election of Bush with a GOP Congress in 2000. When your party has been in the minority that long, they have to deal with many hidden traps and DC shortcuts in the exercise of power. You can sit on top and make policy but it is another thing to get some Democrat in the state department to obey you.

    Bush has 3 years left. If he can win the war and reduce spending, then we will know that the GOP is on track. If not, then the FDR types will come back in 2008 under Hillary Clinton and the GOP will go back into the wilderness.

    Libertarians and the far right do not want to chose sides but want to sit on the sidelines and complain about everything that everyone does. Who needs them?
     
  3. Terry_Herrington

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    :confused:
     
  4. JamesBell

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    These are two good points. On the first, I don't believe that Bush will cut spending. He isn't that kind of conservative; or he hasn't shown any indication that he is. But, winning the war, or improving the situation is important. Combine that with just slowing down growth to some degree, and I think that people will be pleased with the GOP come 2008.

    The far right has been in the pocket of the left for quite some time. Sadly enough, I don't think they even know it. Little "l" liberals and Libertarians (along with the Constitution Part et al.) have fought against our President just about from day one. I don't understand why those on the right would seek to further the cause of the left. It makes no sense to fight against someone you don't like by seeking to help those that you dislike even more. The people on the extreme right need to consider what a Hill-Bill presidency in 2008 would do to their agenda.

    I am just worried that the GOP will swing and miss in 2008. There are many people pushing for McCain or Guilliani to win the primary. Neither could be described as conservative in many circles. That would ruin the progress made up to this point. By selecting one of the candidates that the media and Democrats are in love with, we ensure that we end up with a Dem in office, regardless of who wins the election. I'll be voting for George Allen in the primary. I hope there are a bunch of people following suit.
     
  5. ASLANSPAL

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    If it George Allen does run his opponents could
    go South Carolina primary early on him with
    opposition research(dirt).


    Allen a weakness exposed

    The homosexual activist has even dubbed Allen’s office, “the gayest place on Capitol Hill.”

    <a href="http://www.blogactive.com/2004/08/action-george-allen-virginia-needs-you.html" target="_blank">linked from
    FPN</a>

    James if your candidate does run it may be in
    for a rove style attack even before South Carolina
    primary...but the good news since you plan to
    actively campaign for him is to write him and have
    him clean house and clarify his statements...otherwise he will be ripped to shreds by rovian politics. imho

    sincerely
    Aslanspal
     
  6. JamesBell

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    Aslanpal, there are weaknesses-- there is no doubt. I haven't seen any evidence of his office being the "gayest place on Capitol Hill", but then I am not there all the time. If that is true, that does need to be changed quickly.

    I like the man's politics. I like the history of his political career. I like what (I think) he would do for our country. If he runs the right campaign and keeps the debate focused on issues, and forces the opposition to answer questions about policy while they play political games, he should be OK. I will have to look more into these issues and how they are being handled before I say he is a viable candidate. But then, it isn't unusual for me to support a loser in the primary.
     
  7. Pennsylvania Jim

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    Sure. Evangelical Christians as a whole will follow the GOP anywhere. If the Dems get back in control, they will again oppose these things.

    Pure, unadulterated hypocrisy.
     
  8. fromtheright

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    OK, call me close-minded, but I've got better things to do than read Rockwell calling red states fascist. It puts him in a league with another extremist named Rockwell.
     
  9. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
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    Church mouse guy: "I thought 20 years ago that we were seeing the end of liberalism. However, Reagan rightly defined it as the Iron Triangle (a reference to an area of military difficulty in Viet Nam) of the educational industry, the media industry, and the government worker industry."

    Twenty years ago i had 8 years under my belt on the front
    line of the 'educational insustry' and ten years under my
    belt on the front of the 'government worker industry'.
    I was fighting for better conservatism, what were you doing?

    Now i've got a full 30 years fighting on the front lines
    for the rights of conservatives to have a voice in the
    government. And what do i get for my effort?
    I get accused of being against this president Bush -
    in fact, i was in favor of both Bushes and Regan as well.
    I've fought the liberalization of the educational industry
    for 8 years and 30 years i've fought the liberalization
    of government employees - right on the front line. What do
    i get when i'm old, wounded, and tired? -- i get hassled by
    alleged 'conservatives' who don't even know what 'moderate'
    means, slay the defintion(s) of liberal. What is the
    deal with killing those wounded on the front line
    taking your fight to the enemy while you cower in fear?

    Never don't call me no 'liberal' no more.
    I've been trained as a front line liberal sapper for
    conservative causes - for me pin-headed pseudo-conservatives
    will be a pushover ;)
     
  10. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
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    Your trouble, Ed, is your faulty theology that says that Christ is going to rescue you before the Great Tribulation.
     
  11. Ed Edwards

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    Thank you brother Church mouse guy. I claim the blessing of Matthew 5:11 ;)

    Jesus is going to come get me before the
    Tribulation (lite) the first half of the
    Tribulation - this will be either in death
    when my soul is taken to heaven OR in
    the pretirbulation rapture when my new body
    containing my soul is taken to heaven.
     
  12. church mouse guy

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    Jesus is able to keep you through anything and if he wants you to have your head cut off by Anti-Christ as Paul's head was cut off by Nero, what is it to you? Paul said that he was being poured out as a drink offering.
     
  13. Ed Edwards

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    Conclusion jumped to:
    Ed interpets the Bible like Ed would like
    for it to happen.

    Truth: Ed interpets the Bible like the
    Holy Spirit says to. [​IMG]

    Jesus is going to come get me before
    the tribulation period, the Bible says so.
     
  14. OCC

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    This has to do with the topic...HOW???

    I have a question actually but nobody will answer it so I won't ask it.
     
  15. LadyEagle

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    My sentiments exactly.

    I'm part of the so-called "far right" and I complain, but I also put action behind my complaints & My MAJOR complaint is that the GOP has moved over to the left and is where the left used to be before they went nuts and jumped off the deep end.
     
  16. KenH

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    That's why I stated that I think it is rhetorically a bit over the top. Well, maybe more than a bit. [​IMG]
     
  17. church mouse guy

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    My sentiments exactly.

    I'm part of the so-called "far right" and I complain, but I also put action behind my complaints & My MAJOR complaint is that the GOP has moved over to the left and is where the left used to be before they went nuts and jumped off the deep end.
    </font>[/QUOTE]&lt;personal attack deleted&gt;is not tough-minded and not ready for hard times.

    Of course, Lady Eagle, you overstate your political case as the CP has done some really low things such as state internationally that the war in Iraq is illegal and state that if they were elected they would capitulate and withdraw.

    But to say that the GOP has moved left is a gross overstatement since the CP has taken up a foreign policy position that was discarded by Wendell Wilkie in 1940 when he had the GOP nomination. And look at the CP position of CAFTA--the same as Hugo Chávez, who called it perverse.

    And look at the gratuitous attack against Judge Roberts by the CP--perhaps because he is Catholic. The CP called him pro-choice and tried to misdefine the term settled law in order to smear this nominee.

    The CP has a dirty house: they need to dump their 2004 platform and they need to dump their little bad-debt collection lawyer Peroutka--but that will never happen.

    &lt;personal attack deleted&gt;

    [ August 03, 2005, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]
     
  18. OCC

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    cmg said: &lt;personal attack deleted&gt;

    I say: Funny...I used that very statement in the past and it was edited. &lt;and it just was - LE&gt;

    cmg...gratuitous attacks are made against everyone. Why is it wrong when it's against Judge Roberts? Is it REALLY important whether the Ten Commandments are on a courthouse wall? I don't think so. Besides, people who appear in court already broke a commandment, what good is it to have them on the wall if you don't have John 3:16 or something else on the wall with it?

    [ August 03, 2005, 04:21 PM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]
     
  19. LadyEagle

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    CMG, I am not a member of the CP - I am a registered Republican voter. So your comments re: the CP really don't apply to me personally. If you are ready to say the Republican Party leadership is still on the right or even close to far-right, then you must be ignoring the irrefutable evidence. Log Cabin Republicans ring a bell? The GOP leadership plays too many good cop, bad cop games. There are very few, if any, statesmen - they are all politicians, up for grab to the highest bidder.

    And, BTW, CAFTA is perverse.

    &lt;I edited your post because of the personal attacks on two members - someone reported your Post - personal attacks will not be tolerated.&gt;
     
  20. OCC

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    Hey LE...the Republican party leadership is far from the right now eh? I mean...people accuse liberals of being for big government and interfering with citizens' privacy and individual rights. I believe the present government has done that and more. And they are a pretty big government aren't they?
     

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