What is baptism by the Holy Spirit?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by npetreley, Mar 7, 2007.

  1. npetreley

    npetreley
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    0
    And how does one get baptized by the Holy Spirit? Does it simply mean receiving the Holy Spirit, or is it something more like sanctification? I'm looking for a scriptural answer, not a fuddy duddy conservative answer or a charismatic answer. ;)

    Here are some refs - are these at all related?

    Mark 1:8
    I indeed baptized you with water, but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.

    Luke 11:13
    If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”

    John 20:22
    And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit."

    (They didn't have the Holy Spirit before this?)

    Acts 8:12 But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized. 13 Then Simon himself also believed; and when he was baptized he continued with Philip, and was amazed, seeing the miracles and signs which were done. 14 Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, 15 who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. 16 For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 17 Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

    (This last one is really confusing to me. What did it mean that they had believed and received the word of God? Were they saved yet didn't have the Holy Spirit?)
     
  2. amity

    amity
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2006
    Messages:
    811
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Holy Spirit would only come after Christ Himself had departed. 50 days afterward.

    John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
     
    #2 amity, Mar 7, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 7, 2007
  3. skypair

    skypair
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2006
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi, npeterely

    ...

    Baptism actually symbolizes death (Rom 6:5, 1Cor 15:29). The actual event itself is much like death in that we, when we believe, die to self and are born again to God a "babe in Christ." The important thing is the Spirit indwelling. Since you surrendered your spirit (mind, emotions, and will) to God, He sends His Spirit to live in you unto life!

    And the thing of it is that, since you died, you must be revived by the Holy Spirit resurrection. That is, "at the last day," the OT saints whose bodies are in their graves, will be revived by the Spirit and prought forth from the earth into the MK. Their "baptism," thus, was in soil! But their new life will be totally Holy Spirit if I understand scriptures right. They will, therefore, not be able to procreate nor will they die again. They will be as Christ was in His first advent -- or Adam prefall.

    skypair
     
  4. blackbird

    blackbird
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2002
    Messages:
    11,898
    Likes Received:
    2
    As elementary as I can explain this verse---John the Baptist was simply saying----everthing that I'm doing to you on the outside----the Holy Spirit is going to do on the inside.

    The Holy Spirit immerses---totally envelopes the life of the believer.
     
  5. DQuixote

    DQuixote
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2006
    Messages:
    704
    Likes Received:
    0
    ........and it happens instantly, the very moment one believes!!
     
  6. npetreley

    npetreley
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    0
    Not according to Acts 8:12-17. I'm getting the impression (from the responses) that nobody actually read the original post because most of the replies seem to have anything to do with the issues I raised in addition to the original question.

     
  7. DQuixote

    DQuixote
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2006
    Messages:
    704
    Likes Received:
    0
    Read Acts 18:24-27. Some were only aware of the baptism of John. They did not have a clear understanding of what it meant to receive Christ as Savior and Lord. Eloquent, yes, but not yet placed within the Body of Christ.

    Acts 9 is the dividing point for the ministry to we Gentiles, under our teacher, Paul.

    The moment we’re saved the Holy Spirit comes in, and indwells us. He then becomes our teacher. The Holy Spirit is the One Who opens up an understanding of the Scriptures. I Corinthians 2:10. The new believer is told that he is not alone -- the Holy Spirit dwells within. We simply pray for God to teach us. Prior to receiving the Holy Spirit we are not teachable in the church age, the age of grace.
     
    #7 DQuixote, Mar 8, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2007
  8. npetreley

    npetreley
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    0
    That just isn't the way this passage reads. And they don't receive the Holy Spirit when they believe.

    First:

    Later:

     
  9. Jack Matthews

    Jack Matthews
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2006
    Messages:
    833
    Likes Received:
    1
    v.16 says they had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, so that can't really be the case.

    I think this instance is a second "Pentecost." It was the result of the fact that the Jewish Christians needed a visible sign that "gentile" believers in Christ would be, in this new faith, equal to themselves. It's a paradigm shift of which Peter writes later on, "But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light. Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy." I Peter 2:9-10 Peter and John, sent by the Jerusalem church, witnessed this event.

    "Baptism" in the Holy Spirit is the spiritual work of sanctification and justification that must take place in order for one to be made right with God. In this period of the beginnings of the church, it's delayed arrival in certain instances is an experience that is clearly associated with the beginnings of the church. Once the Holy Spirit was "sent" and his arrival confirmed by specific signs and wonders, there are no other instances where there is a delay between belief and spiritual baptism.
     
    #9 Jack Matthews, Mar 8, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2007
  10. DQuixote

    DQuixote
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2006
    Messages:
    704
    Likes Received:
    0
    Oops! I was editing when you replied!

    Philip told folks about Christ, the Messiah, here in fulfillment of the OT promise, and they got happy and accepted water baptism without realizing that Christ was to be invited in as Savior & Lord. Later it was more carefully explained; they then believed, authentically, and instantly became born-again, Spirit-filled members of the church. The "laying on of hands" was not subsequently essential for folks who simply understood what they were doing and believed. I think it would be hard to find many Baptists who would testify that they received the Holy Spirit when hands were laid on them! The critical questions are WHO was speaking, to WHOM, and WHAT ABOUT?

    Acts 8:12 "But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women."

    This is early-on. It is not Paul speaking to we Gentiles. Much confusion can be avoided when we Gentiles stick with the letters of Paul. That doesn't mean we ignore the 4 gospels; it means we rightly divide scripture.

    Clearly, Peter was speaking to Jews as a group.
     
    #10 DQuixote, Mar 8, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2007
  11. skypair

    skypair
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2006
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    0
    npeterely

    Sorry. I think I see your question now.

    Peter was the one with the "keys to the kingdom" {Mt 16:19) to "open" the church in "Judea [Pentecost], in Samaria [here], and to the utmost parts of the world [confirming Paul to the Gentiles, I thnk]." As such, he needed to visit Samaria to extend the Spirit to them.

    Now this is an "object lesson" for us to recognize that there was in operation during the transition (30 - 70 AD) a period when both OT and NT-type salvations existed simultaneously. More such is revealed in Acts 19:1-6, this time because they had not called upon the name of Jesus. OT saints did NOT receive the Spirit -- NT saints do.

    Is that what you were looking for?

    skypair
     
    #11 skypair, Mar 9, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 9, 2007
  12. amity

    amity
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2006
    Messages:
    811
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sorry. I STILL don't understand your question!

    When you ask is A = B, maybe you could give some other alternatives (C and D) that would help clarify.
     

Share This Page

Loading...