What is your absolute final authority?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by AVBunyan, Nov 10, 2006.

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  1. AVBunyan

    AVBunyan
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    Two simple questions – not here to challenge or debate – just wondering:

    1. Do you have one absolute final authority?

    2. If you do then what is your absolute final authority?
    Where do you go to get to the "bottom" of it all?
    Example – The NASV, certain Lexicon, a certain Greek professor, your pastor, etc.

    #1 should be simple yes or no.

    #2 Get can get more complicated.
    On this point please refrain from using general terms such as God - for we all know God is our final authority but how do you know what God says?
    Also please refrain from just saying, “The Bible is my final authority” unless you are going to narrow down your choice to which Bible for this forum and others demonstrate they all read different?

    So, do you have an absolute final authority and if so what is it?

    I’ll demonstrate how simple this can be:

    1. Yes
    2. Any off-the-shelf King James Bible will do

    Again – not looking to agree/disagree, debate, argue, or blow a gasket over your choice, etc. If someone were to say, "Mad Magazine is my final authority ." then I won't bat an eye - really. Not trying to do a "setup" here.

    Thanks
    God bless
     
    #1 AVBunyan, Nov 10, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2006
  2. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K)
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    1. yes
    2. the Bible under the direction of the Holy Spirit, who promises to guide me into all truth
     
    #2 NaasPreacher (C4K), Nov 10, 2006
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  3. Brandon C. Jones

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    Why is this in the Bible Versions/Translations forum?

    If "God" (including the Holy Spirit I presume) and "the Bible" are off of the table, then is this not a referendum on X-English-Version-only stuff? Of which I know of only one version that has such a status among Baptists here.
     
    #3 Brandon C. Jones, Nov 10, 2006
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  4. Rufus_1611

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    1. Yes
    2. Any off-the-shelf King James Bible will do (preferably without some man's commentary)
     
  5. tinytim

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    1) yes
    2) The whole Bible as originally written.

    Now the hard part then falls on translation comittees to make sure their translation is accurate to the originals... and since no original exists, then that is where textual criticism helps.

    And I added the word, "whole" to the answer, because, when searching for an answer concerning doctrine, or a life application, I use the Bible as a whole, instead of just a few verses here and there to "prove my point"

    BTW... any off the shelf KJV will do .. I love the KJV!
    But I use a 4 Bible parallel....This is what I carry!

    KJV, NIV, NLT, and NASB..
    But I only preach from one version!! Can you imagine the length of the sermon if I used all 4?!!!!!
    No one would get to Denny's in time to beat the Methodists.:laugh: :laugh:
     
  6. robycop3

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    1. yes.

    2. Any valid version of the Bible.
     
  7. deacon jd

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    1. Asolutely without a doubt
    2. The perfect Word of God as found in the King James Bible
     
  8. AVBunyan

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    Fine tuning

    Thanks fellas for the responses thus far - Let's clarify or fine tune a bit shall we? :thumbsup:

    See quote above - the Bible sounds good but then one gets into what does one mean by "the Bible" - the originals, a version or translation, etc.?

    If you answered yes to the first question then you are saying that you have A final authority - I'm assuming the A means one.

    So if one answers, "any valid translation" then if they read different then which one is your FINAL authority. For many here say some are valid and some are not - Which valid one is it for even valid ones read differently.

    Again - not trying to disagree with you answer but to fine tune according to the OP. Maybe I wasn't clear. :type:

    God bless
     
  9. Scott J

    Scott J
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    1- Yes.

    2- The Bible... OK, I won't do that to you. The Word of God as preserved in several sets of human words (aka, versions). These versions are mutually affirming in doctrine and teaching. On the rare occasion when there is a textual variant that might be stretched into some claim of "contradiction", I follow the advice of the KJV translators. Paraphrase: In those passages where there is doubt, prudence demands caution rather than boldness/arrogance.

    They ascribed those variants to allowances of God's providence.

    Any novel doctrine that is derived from any version that is contradicted by a plain reading of many other faithful versions and texts... is all but certainly a false doctrine.
     
  10. Deacon

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    Lazy, lazy, lazy…

    Lazy, lazy, lazy…. It’s not that easy!
    I’ll take up the argument of AVBunyan for a bit.

    What is the “Bible” or “word of God”?

    1. We can say that God preserved it in a particular manuscript, translation or version [KJVonlyism].

    2. We can say that the inerrant word is contained within the documents we have collected (as in the BHS, the NA27/UBS or the various TR’s), claiming that nothing is absent that wasn’t in the autographa.
    The word of God is before us but it takes work to find it.
    I’m not convinced that this is correct mainly because it has a modern bias.
    What did previous generations rely upon?
    What about further manuscript discoveries?

    Tim added: “ Now the hard part then falls on translation committees to make sure their translation is accurate to the originals... and since no original exists, then that is where textual criticism helps.

    This puts the final authority in the hand of the church, or at least translating committees.

    3. We can modify the definition of plenary inspiration and say that the form of individual words (spelling, verbal tenses, etc.) is not included in the formulation of inerrancy: denying a verbal plenary inspiration.
    We have the word of God in each of books we have before us.
    IMO, this leaves us without a final authority.

    4. We can say that we don't have inerrant texts in our hands today.
    We have what God wants us to know.

    5., 6. ….I’m sure there are other options.

    So,,,,

    1. Do you have one absolute final authority?

    Yes

    2. If you do then what is your absolute final authority?

    God, as revealed in his word, under the guidance of the holy Spirit, using what wisdom he has given me.

    …but I live by faith, relying upon his grace.

    Rob
     
  11. franklinmonroe

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    1. Yes!

    2. The Holy Spirit.

    He often speaks to me through Bibles. (I typically don't read the ones He doesn't speak to me through.)

    But if I were stranded on a desert island without a Bible of any kind, I'd still have a final authority. (But I'd surely hope to have a Bible on that island, even if it were a really poor translation.)
     
    #11 franklinmonroe, Nov 10, 2006
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  12. robycop3

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    There are many differences between the Four Gospels, as found in any given Bible version. In fact, there are greater differences between the Gospels in one Bible version than there are between the several English Bibles. But do I accept all of them as Scripture? Absolutely!

    Therefore, I have no authority to accept ONLY ONE VERSION as "THE" final authority. You may choose only one by PERSONAL PREFERENCE, but there's no justification for rejecting all others. And teaching others that there's only ONE valid version is WRONG!
     
  13. steveo

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    The gospels do differ because God inspired the writers to write with thier own style, character, etc... I don't think this is a good analogy by saying the translations being different is equal to to the gospels differing.
    Just my 2 cents :)
     
  14. robycop3

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    Thanx for your $0.02...

    BUT...

    Could GOD not have inspired different ms writers to likewise write, and different translators to work in their own styles and beliefs?
     
  15. Deacon

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    Many that stand behind one version also are convinced that not only their version is authoritative but also their interpretation of it.
    We’ve seen people argue with vehemence about a particular doctrine.
    I’m almost convinced that they would argue with God himself if, in eternity, they found out they were wrong.
    My authority is God. My belief about his word is based upon his character: what emanates from God is without err.

    I’m convinced that man’s character is flawed (I understand this through intimate personal experience and through the conviction of the Spirit as I read his word).
    What emanates from man reveals man’s character
    We are flawed and prone to err
    (this would include not only doctrine but the copying holy manuscripts).
    Even in our rebirth we are limited in our understanding (“I know in part" (imperfectly) - 1 Corinthians 13:12 ).
    Further defining the written word will probably not bring us any closer to understanding God.

    While I’m convinced regarding the inerrancy of the autographa, I’m not fully convinced we need to apply that word to what we hold in our hands today.
    I see some area where we are uncertain of the meaning (1 Corinthians 14:34), areas where the text is uncertain and areas where the text has degraded (1 Samuel 13:1).

    Just a very few of these uncertainties affect ones doctrine:
    they do not affect the message of grace told in the gospel.

    Rob
     
  16. Deacon

    Deacon
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    I must be speaking heresy.

    The ad next to my post reads:

    666, This is it
    The Mark, the Number, the Beast
    Learn it here
    Guaranteed


    Rob :saint:
     
  17. Keith M

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    Here is a large part of your problem - you think that, because the individual words are different, the modern versions contradict one another. This is a false supposition. The legitimate modern versions all are perfectly preserved in matters of doctrine. Can you show a single legitimate MV that doesn't teach the plan of salvation? Can you show a single legitimate MV that teaches that there is anything that atones for our sins but the shed blood of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ? Can you show a single legitimate MV that does not tell the history of the early church? Of course you can't, because your supposed contradictions do not exist. These "contradictions" are figments of the imagination.

    It is true that there are non-legitimate versions that masquerade as the word of God. Such versions as the Inspired Version (Mormon), the Clear Word Translation (Seventh Day Adventist) and the New World Translation (Jehovah's Witnesses) are not legitimate Bible versions in that they are "translated" so that these errant groups can finally have "bibles" that agree with their false teachings. But it is also a false teaching that the legitimate modern versions are contradictory. It is true that their words are not the same, but their message is the same.

    A for the OP -
    1. Yes
    2. The word of God as interpreted by the Holy Spirit that is in me
     
    #17 Keith M, Nov 10, 2006
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  18. rbell

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    1. Yes.
    2. The Bible--the original autographs. I found them last week...they were mixed up in my Christmas decorations. Sorry I kept them so long.
     
  19. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
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    NO! No!

    It is my turn to be the comic relief -- not you :BangHead:
     
  20. Ed Edwards

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    O.P: //1. Do you have one absolute final authority?//

    Yes

    O.P. //2. If you do then what is your absolute final authority?//

    My misunderstanding of of what God said.

    This my NOT be satisfactory to most Bible scholars
    or self-declared religious people; but it sure is common :(
     
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