I start a thread to discuss verses, I am gone for half a day and the thread ends up being closed due to a train wreck. Here is the where the discussion was last left by me: What are your comments on that verse, Proverbs 16:9? What does God determine? So you would say that having God be the first cause of everything is making Him the author of sin? And you also consider that to be a hyper-Calvinist view? Am I understanding your position right? johnp says he's not a hyper-calvinist are there any others on here that you think are hyper-calvinists? what else defines a hyper-Calvinist?