What separates the most liberal Baptists from Unitarian Universalists?

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by BWSmith, Jan 7, 2002.

  1. BWSmith

    BWSmith
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    I know that, under soul freedom, there's nothing stopping a Baptist from going anywhere on the spectrum between ultra-conservatism and atheism. However, is there anything in particular that separates a UU from very liberal Baptists?

    For example, would any Baptists that are Universalists and Unitarians claim that non-Christian religions convey "equal truth" about God with Christianity?
     
  2. Helen

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    What matters is NOT what different groups might think or accept.

    What matters is what the Bible says.

    What matters is that Jesus said HE is the way, the truth, and the life, and that no one has access to the Father but through HIM.

    What matters is that Peter says that there is no other name under heaven which brings salvation.

    What matters is the truth, not what this or that group thinks about it.
     
  3. BWSmith

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    And yet, the plethora of denominations is testimony to the extent that not everyone agrees on "what the Bible says"...
     
  4. TomVols

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    BWSmith wrote:
    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> I know that, under soul freedom, there's nothing stopping a Baptist from going anywhere on the spectrum between ultra-conservatism and atheism. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    No offense, BWSmith, but am I the only one who sees something really, really wrong about this? The idea that you have the freedom to believe almost anything and yet still be a Baptist, or worse still be a Christian seems anathema to me. Am I totally off base here? (Tom opens the door for Michael Wrenn, et.al., to pounce with that last phrase :D )
     
  5. BWSmith

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    TomVols wrote:
    &gt; No offense, BWSmith, but am I the only one who sees something really, really wrong about this? The idea that you have the freedom to believe almost anything and yet still be a Baptist, or worse still be a Christian seems anathema to me. Am I totally off base here?

    No, you are totally on-base. Soul freedom is both the best and worst thing about being a Baptist.

    Our instinct as Christians is to think like the Catholics; in which there is one set of orthodox truth that is prepetuated and enforced by the universal church.

    Unfortunately, our legacy as Baptists lies in escape from persecution. Soul freedom is the acknowledgement that it isn't as simple as that. The only way to remove tyranny is to grant an umbrella to a wide spectrum of opinion.

    No one has a copyright on the term "Baptist", nor should anyone seek a copyright on it. We are held together by a rope of sand under the statistical assumption that those left/right wing extremists will change their label before remaining "extreme Baptists".

    My question has more to do with determining at what point it becomes silly to refer to oneself as a "Baptist" on the left end of the spectrum.
     
  6. Chris Temple

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TomVols:
    BWSmith wrote:


    No offense, BWSmith, but am I the only one who sees something really, really wrong about this? The idea that you have the freedom to believe almost anything and yet still be a Baptist, or worse still be a Christian seems anathema to me. Am I totally off base here? (Tom opens the door for Michael Wrenn, et.al., to pounce with that last phrase :D )
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    As the late J. Gresham Machen of Princeton said:

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>The chief modern rival of Christianity is "liberalism." An examination of the teachings of liberalism will show that at every point the liberal movement is in opposition to the Christian message.

    A terrible crisis has arisen in the Church. In the ministry of evangelical churches are to be found hosts of those who reject the gospel of Christ. By the equivocal use of traditional phrases, by the representation of differences of opinion as though they were only differences about the interpretation of the Bible, entrance into the Church was secured for those who are hostile to the very foundations of the faith. And now there are some indications that the fiction of conformity to the past is to be thrown off, and the real meaning of what has been taking place is to be allowed to appear. The Church, it is now apparently supposed, has almost been educated up to the point where the shackles of the Bible can openly be cast away and the doctrine of the Cross of Christ can be relegated to the limbo of discarded subtleties.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    See
    Liberalism or Christianity?
     
  7. HankD

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    Dear BW,

    One day whilst surfin the WEB, I found documentation of a Baptist Trinitarian Universalist (in doctrine) Church (yes Trinitarian) in Boston around the turn of the 17th century (1830ish).
    The pastor of said church wrote that eventually all men will be saved because hell is temporary, kind of like the Catholic view of Purgatory.
    He used the UU proof text that Christ "is the savior of all men especially of those that believe" 1 Timothy 4:10.
    Those in hell will accept Christ there (every knee shall bow, etc),
    I don't know if it should be called a cult, but perhaps a curious deviation from orthodoxy.
    So it doesn't take liberalism to be a universalist (as this with 17th century Baptist pastor).

    HankD

    [ January 08, 2002: Message edited by: HankD ]
     
  8. BWSmith

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    So is it safe to say that 99.999% of Baptists are Trinitarians?
     
  9. Pastor Larry

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BWSmith:
    So is it safe to say that 99.999% of Baptists are Trinitarians?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I don't think the percentage would be that low. Why are you not a trinitarian?
     
  10. BWSmith

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    Of course I am. I'm just trying to determine the cutoff between the most liberal Baptists and UU's.
     
  11. rsr

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    Really need to get Rev. Joshua here on this one.

    I think the UU comparison is perhaps a stretch. Closer, I think, is the United Churches of Christ, with whom some Baptist congregations have an informal relationship.
    http://allianceofbaptists.org/ucc.htm
     

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