Featured When is a person saved?

What I see is because of His Foreknowledge, this is the key. What God foreknew about the choices you would make He therefore predestinated you to be a child of His.
He didn't chose to save you randomly, He chose those who would trust Christ, Those He knew would make a positive choice to believe on His son to be children of God.

1 Peter 1: 2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Peter says we are Elect according to the foreknowledge of God.

Paul said:
Romans 8: 29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Who He did foreknow He also did predestinate.

Our election, our calling, our justification and glorification are all based on what God foreknew about us. He knew what choice we would make. He didn't force us to make a choice, he didn't determine by His will that we would make that choice, He FOREKNEW the choice we would make and therefore elected us based on that choice.

 

Hey revmwc,

I said the same thing yesterday and then Skandelon replied thus:

What do you think?

 

God knew the choice you would make before you were ever born. Just as He did with Esau and Jacob. God because He foreknew you and the choices you would make predestinated you to be conformed to the image of His Son. He predestinated the individual because He knew the choice they would make. He didn't force the choice, He Knew the choice. Why becasue He is omniscient.

 

Is the following predestinated?

And the all things of God, who reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and did give to us the ministration of the reconciliation, how that God was in Christ -- a world reconciling to Himself, not reckoning to them their trespasses; and having put in us the word of the reconciliation,

For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Just what is the plan of the reconciliation? Is everyone presently being called?
Are some actually blinded presently? Are not all born in trespass and sins (blind)?
Paul was blindly on his way down the road to put in prison and or kill those of the way. Who opened his eyes? Was he thinking about the last few days and suddenly come to the conclusion, that guy Stephen we stoned the other day was right. Why did Paul believe Jesus was the Christ? My sheep hear my voice and they follow me.

Gen 12:1 And Jehovah saith unto Abram, `Go for thyself, from thy land, and from thy kindred, and from the house of thy father, unto the land which I shew thee.
Gen 12:4 And Abram departed, as Jehovah hath spoken unto him

Did Abram depart because Abram had faith in the Lord or was it by faithfulness Abram departed when he was called for through the sheep Abram
God was going to bring about the seed of the Woman? To Abraham and his seed were the promises made not seeds as of many but as of one, and that seed is Christ.

G3:19 Wherefore then the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; [and it was] ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
G3:23 But before the faith came, we were kept under the law,
shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
G3:25 But after that the faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

It was through the faith of the one to whom the promise was made that you could be removed from under the penalty of the law. To give you hope for life by the resurrection of the one who had faith in his Father of raising him from the dead. He has received the promise. You are an heir of the promise that he has received. Abraham died not having received the promise, He is still dead today not having received the promise but his seed Christ has received the promise and Abraham and we will receive the promise at the next appearing of Jesus.

Right or Wrong?

 

That's true. An elect person will not die before he is saved.

Not at all. I'm not sure how you can say this. It doesn't follow logic to say such a thing.

Now, where are you disagreeing. Are you disagreeing that God's will isn't absolute? Of course not! So, let me ask you this. If I were to have asked God 1000 years ago if you were going to be saved, could God have said yes. So could you have died before you got saved? If you say yes, then God was wrong.

Remember to ask yourself your own questions before asking them to someone else.

btw, did you understand my other points? You attempted an argument on the atonement. Do you understand the importance of the atonement now?

 

Because God is just. Are you disagreeing with "god is all powerful and can do anything"?

God

Because he is just. Are you disagreeing?

Because I'm a sinner.

What are you asking? Why don't you ask yourself these same questions.

You need to be very careful. Are you sure you know what you are saying? Are you really denying the purpose of the atonement? Are you really saying that God could have just forgiven without an atonement?

First, we do have choices. So drop that straw man. Second, the atonement has nothing to do with our choices.

Ok, but this has nothing to do with the atonement.

 

I guess this is my main problem with DoG. It just doesnt fit with the entire Bible the way freewill does. There are too many verses that freewill explains and really none that DoG explains without taking them out of context and mixing a bunch of unrelated verses together.

Ok, but this has nothing to do with the atonement.

Its NOT OK (since he doesn't have a clue what Doctrines of Grace truly is) & you are correct JBH, it has nothing to do with the atonement.

 

There's not difference. The purpose of the atonement is exactly the same in the free will side vs the reformed side. The only difference is limited vs unlimited, but not the purpose of the atonement.

Jesus Christ was sacrificed to pay for sin. We are sinners. it has nothing to do with free will.

 

All have sinned and come short of the Glory of God therefore the Atonement of Christ was for all sinners. The difference is accepting or rejecting the free gift of Salvation that atonement brings. That is an individual choice by the person. I chose to receive Christ because God knew what my choice would be He Predestinated me.
God gave man the ability to choose to accept or reject but He did not choose who would accept or reject, He knew who would through His omnicience.

 

Because man is a sinner and a just punishment must be made.

No, the purpose of the atonement was to pay for sin. It has nothing to do with choice.

It is the correct answer. God is just and He requires a just punishment for sin.

Ok John, let's try to not say false things. I've very clearly answered your questions. (Oh and don't talk to me in the third person) You are being inconsistent and so I asked for you to ask yourself the same questions.

Very false. We dont' do that at all. I've been very kind with you and patient.

John, you need to cool down. You have a very bad attitude and shouldn't be posting like you are. I've attempted to have a civil discussion with you, but you have now resorted to saying I have a "self righteous" attitude and say that I treat you as you were a fool. Nothing could be further from the truth. I've answered your questions, but asked you to ask yourself the same questions. If you think about it, it appears that you are denying the sovereignty of God. I don't believe you are, but if you were to ask yourself the same question you asked me, you would see.

If you would like to continue, please refrain from the derogatory comments.

 

Ok, I of course disagree as that's not God choosing, but the purpose of the atonement doesn't change. It's still required by God because God is holy and just and requires a just punishment for sin.